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Patrick G cam= horrible results by paul_3rdgen on 28 Jul, 2011 20:10
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I decided it was time for a cam swap, got it spec'd out by the all knowing Patrick G on Ls1tech and installed it this winter. The car just hit the streets a couple of weeks ago, so now off to the dyno for a tune..... we make a pull on the dyno and to my surprise I'm running an almost 10:1 AF ratio and the car is making no power.
I look at my buddy who owns the shop and say WTF, he says I told you to leave it alone! So i asked him, what do you mean....he says never change a cam in an N/A motor just because your bored, it never works out.......the car lost power every where and gained 10 horse power up top after 5500rpm. So, I asked my buddy who owns the dyno to put up an overlay of my old tune(with the previous cam) and the new tune with this new shit cam. It lost 20rwtq and 20rwhp across the board, WTF 
We had to pull tons of fuel and add lots of timing and we werent getting anything better so we gave up and unstrapped the car.
I decided it couldn't hurt to contact Patrick and tell him what happened, he writes back and says he is equally disappointed and wants the overlay so he could make heads or tails of it. Next morning i recieve another email from him saying that I must of installed the cam wrong because it just doesn't add up, and that the temp difference between the days could have something to do with it....excuses, excuses.
After consulting a couple of friends they tell me that the cam is all wrong for an NA motor and you have to try an adjustable cam gear to see if that will help before you go and buy a new cam. I now suggest this to Patrick and what do you know he is liking the idea.....feeling guilty or you know you fucked up on the specs?
Old cam Futral F6 226"/230" .575"/.595" 112LSA
New cam Comp EPS lobes 230/234 .600/ .602 114+2 advance
What do you guys think? wrong cam? and if I advance it 2-3 degrees will that help?
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#1 by dream36realms on 28 Jul, 2011 20:31
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I would advance it and give it a shot. If it was a forced intuction cam it wouldnt have such high lobes, FI cams are generally longer duration less lift hence the name chopsticks.
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#2 by Speedfab on 28 Jul, 2011 21:24
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Oh my, good thing you didn't post this on LS1tard, you'd probably get banned.
But seriously, I have no clue why so many people are willing to let some guy who apparently just owns an internet marketing business tell them what cam to put in their cars as opposed to a CAMSHAFT MANUFACTURER with tons of actual experience in their personnel. -
#3 by digitalsolo on 28 Jul, 2011 21:44
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This ^
I met with an engine designer to discuss cam profile ideas. Like, a real engine designer at Lingenfelter. Internet Voodoo = no bueno.
That said, it sucks to hear that you're down power. Do you still have the old cam? -
#4 by BeasTT on 28 Jul, 2011 21:49
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Did you leave the cam stored horizontally for any period of time?
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#5 by zbrown on 28 Jul, 2011 23:12
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Did you leave the cam stored horizontally for any period of time?
lol the problem is found.... -
#6 by WAT TURBO? on 28 Jul, 2011 23:22
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Is it possible he sent you the wrong cam? I guess you would have to pull the rear cover to check...
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#7 by Tweek on 29 Jul, 2011 11:02
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There has to be another problem some where else. PatrickG uses eps cam lobes and I have a custom cam that was spec'd by Geoff at eps. Mines a 226/234 .600/.602 113+2 and my car is an animal. Also look at Mattsters car similar sized cam cut on the same lobes.
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#8 by Sabre002 on 29 Jul, 2011 11:09
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Oh my, good thing you didn't post this on LS1tard, you'd probably get banned.
But seriously, I have no clue why so many people are willing to let some guy who apparently just owns an internet marketing business tell them what cam to put in their cars as opposed to a CAMSHAFT MANUFACTURER with tons of actual experience in their personnel.
Thank you, I tried to tell Roman this shit when he wanted to take the cam out of his motor, and replace it for a G-off cam. After swithing cams and decking the heads .020 it made the same numbers if not less. I looked at him and was like told ya. His reason was its easier on the valve springs then the one I had in it. I just said ok and went on. That motor would have made the 500 mark with the old cam and decked heads. -
#9 by mattster03 on 29 Jul, 2011 11:17
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Yes, my cam is an EPS 230/238 112+2 LSA cam and it's making pretty damn good power (130 mph traps with some budget heads). I did not have Patrick spec my cam, I just told Geoff what I wanted and it arrived on my porch in a few weeks. There has been at least one instance of the patrick/geoff show sending out a cam with the incorrect specs; i'd have to dig around a little if you want to see it. Paul why did you go with the 114LSA when you had 112 before? What is your timing at and what are your AFR's?
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#10 by Troux on 29 Jul, 2011 11:24
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Did you leave the cam stored horizontally for any period of time?
Someone explain? -
#11 by mattster03 on 29 Jul, 2011 11:26
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Did you leave the cam stored horizontally for any period of time?
Someone explain?
it's an inside joke from a recently new member posting a "fact" that you should only store cams vertically so that they don't warp when laying on their sides.
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#12 by BeasTT on 29 Jul, 2011 11:33
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Did you leave the cam stored horizontally for any period of time?
Someone explain?
BAM
http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=4929.msg102723#msg102723 -
#13 by cool on 29 Jul, 2011 12:00
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Id want to know the specs of the cam you received vs. what its claimed to be.
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#14 by digitalsolo on 29 Jul, 2011 12:02
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There has to be another problem some where else. PatrickG uses eps cam lobes and I have a custom cam that was spec'd by Geoff at eps. Mines a 226/234 .600/.602 113+2 and my car is an animal. Also look at Mattsters car similar sized cam cut on the same lobes.
Why would that automatically mean Patrick spec'd the perfect cam in this case?