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Vendor Forums => Ronin Speedworks => Topic started by: frijolee on February 18, 2011, 04:44:30 PM

Title: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 18, 2011, 04:44:30 PM
This project's been done and we have a bunch of folks that have been rocking these for a while now with no issues to date.  It seems to be a great way to up your rear end strength, minimize or eliminate wheel hop, and run your choice of gear ratio and LSD.  You can order at roninspeedworks.com whenever you're ready.   Specifically:

http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=70 (http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=70)

There's a great many pictures and reviews scattered throughout this thread.  We've tweaked fitment a few time but the basic design of the first post is still accurate.  I'm adding a few shots of our custom halfshafts that let you make the conversion from Ford inner CVs to Mazda outers.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0905Custom.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0906Custom.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0909Custom.JPG)

The rest of this thread remains the original and is kept for posterities sake.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



It's time to start sharing more details about what we've been working on for the FC's Ford 8.8 IRS kit.  For the moment these should only be considered development pictures as we're still working out a few details.  That said, I wanted to start getting folks excited and I'm rather proud of our progress to date. 

Assumptions:

-Weld in front mount requiring a minimum of mods to the stock mazda subframe
-Front mount will support diff from below so a secondary capture plate will be provided to provide a redundant load path to the top (see nuts in the side of the weld in portion)
-02-05 Ford Explorer 8.8 being used due to better packaging with the single sided front mount (also used in Lincoln Aviator and Mercury Marineer).  These are plentiful, cheap, and have aluminum cases w/ lots of support fins.
-OEM style rear mounts let you run whatever kind of bushings you want.
-2 to 3 degree target front pinion angle
-Two piece slip yokes will be required for DS removal
-Target pricepoint of ~$1800 (user's total cost for everything)

Front mount:

Support nuts for redundant load path:
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3057Medium.JPG)

We have a crush tube welded in for the main front bolt (edges will be ground flat):
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3059Medium.JPG)

Fit check in car w/ Explorer diff (redudant load path not shown but will wrap the top surface like an upsidedown "L")
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3060Medium.JPG)

It indexes off the tie rod mount hole and follows the contours well.
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3062Medium.JPG)

Fit check from above (ignore the t2 diff, just showing how well this fits on a spare subframe prior to weld in)
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3063Medium.JPG)


Cover modifications:

We're not using the stock mount ears on the explorer diff cover because that puts us into the gas tank straps (clearing the subframe w/o significant cutting puts this slightly further aft than AndrewB70's Cobra version).

Stock:
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/dDSC_0612Medium.JPG)

Cut using a 4.5" angle grinder:
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/dDSC_0617Medium.JPG)

End result:
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/dDSC_0614Medium.JPG)


Rear mount:

First article welded up:
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3086Medium.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3088Medium.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3090Medium.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3094Medium.JPG)


Note, we're still optomizing fitment.  For example in the last pic above we found we need about 1/8" more clearance to the fuel line bracket.  As such we've only welded up one of the rear mounts.  We also have some slightly differences between the first article and our mockup mounting so we need to get that squared away prior to welding up the others so we can ship these to our testers. 

That's progress to date.  After we get the final fitment nailed we'll transition into halfshaft design.

Regards,
Joel

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ImportEvolution on February 18, 2011, 06:02:14 PM
Glad you guys are doing this!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 346fc3s on February 18, 2011, 09:23:53 PM
That looks awesome, just out of curiosity how are you getting the driveshaft flange to clear the subframe?  I had to notch my subframe a bit to clear it, although part of that was hinson's driveshaft flange being larger than the flange on the diff, but still, it was damn close.  The stuff you cut off the diff looks just like what I did to mine except I cut down the speed sensor too just to make it look a little cleaner. 

I don't know if you tried it without the L bracket to cover the top of the front mount but let me tell you it is vitally important that you have something up there.  I just had a bolt with a washer on it at the beginning and the first hard launch I did ripped the center out of the bushing.  A new bushing from ford and a washer large enough to cover the entire bushing and it's been fine ever since.  I have a good amount of experience with axles and brakes that will match your mandeville setup very nicely if you're interested. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on February 19, 2011, 11:01:48 AM
Hey Joel, Nice work guys! :D

Hey I think that back cover mount may work with my setup with the T bird rear and my crossmember. I'm going to have mine apart in a while here, if you'd like to have me test fit it for you I could. :)

I have to take mine out to install a baffle into the inside cover to deflect fuild from the breather. So if you think you would like to try it, PM me. maybe we can work out something.

From the looks of the back plate/cover part, its got to be really close to 1 inch forward of CV axle center. Am I correct?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on February 19, 2011, 01:36:52 PM
This looks very cool Joel!
 
I really like the rear brace design - somewhat similar to others designs but with a much stiffer over the top strap reinforcement for better side to side torsional strength/rigidity.  You can also use a support griddle cover with your design as well - which is important with higher HP/torque levels. 
 
A couple of questions.  Will the SF cross member be owner modified or will they be done on a jig and supplied by you on an exchange basic?  How much have you changed the axle center-line position at the differential?  Is that change going to pose an issue during hard acceleration as the tire tries to move forward or with the suspension geometry and triangulation during articulation, both squat or extension?

Keep up the great work and many thanks from the FC community.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Marshessn on February 19, 2011, 02:14:16 PM
Dude this is awesome. keep up the excellent work. I will definitely be interested in this.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 19, 2011, 06:47:56 PM
Looking great guys. I can't wait to get my hands on this.

How much clearance is there around the vent tube area? It looks like we will need to run a 90 degree fitting.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on February 20, 2011, 10:01:48 AM
Will the subframe have to be dropped once the Ford diff is installed, like the way the stock set-up is designed?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 346fc3s on February 20, 2011, 01:16:26 PM
Just out of curiosity how much does that mount weigh? It looks like you've got delrin bushings in there, will you have options for poly or rubber for those that don't want the NVH of solid mounts?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on February 20, 2011, 03:10:13 PM
Well since Joel isn't answering the questions, I'll answer a couple.

The subframe will need to be dropped to drop the diff, just like how it was before with the Mazda rear.

You should be able to run some poly bushings in the back, and something with some compliance in the front, but I think it is better to run solid mounts.

The mount weighs somewhere in the 12lb - 15lb range, but I don't have an actual weight. I will throw it on a scale when I get a chance.

The subframes will need minor mods that anyone capable of doing a swap should be able to do. You will need to trim the lip of the subframe slightly and weld in the front mount that will come with the kit. The front mount as you can see in the pictures indexes off the subframe contours and the sleeve for the toe link. There is really no way to screw it up, you then will need to weld it in place.

Anthony
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 20, 2011, 03:26:45 PM
With this setup you will want to run all 3 mounts with similar levels of compliance. If you want to run rubber, you will need to run rubber in both the front and rear mounts. If you want to run solid, you will want to run delrin in the rear and a solid alumnium mount in the front. You will also want to run solid subframe bushings if you choose to go solid with the diff mounts.

The rear diffmounts are the OEM size so you can run OEM, Mazdacomp stiffer rubber, or delrin mounts.

I will be running all solid mounts. I have talked to Joel and I believe (don't quote me on this) that there will be an alumnium front mount for the Explorer diff available as an option for this kit. That is what I intend to use for a front mount.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on February 20, 2011, 03:46:40 PM
I will definitely be putting funds aside for this when it's full production. Just one less thing to worry about once this is installed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on February 20, 2011, 04:02:47 PM
I was hoping my subframe dropping days was gonna come to an end.

Anyways, can we get a break down of what the $1800 consist of?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Tweek on February 20, 2011, 05:45:55 PM
i feel like a little kid waiting for christmas!!!! 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 20, 2011, 05:55:04 PM
I was hoping my subframe dropping days was gonna come to an end.

Anyways, can we get a break down of what the $1800 consist of?


Dropping the subframe is not that hard. If you have the tools, more than one jack and a couple jackstands you have have it out of the car in 30 minutes.

As a rough list you will need:

02-05 Explorer diff and at minimum the complete Explorer inner CVs
TII outer CVs
Custom halfshafts to mate Explorer inner CVs to TII outer CVs
Driveshaft with proper yokes (this will need to be longer than the C4 driveshaft)
Ronin Explorer Diff mounting kit

You will need to source your own diff and Explorer inners for sure. Ronin will provide the mounting kit and at minimum recommendations of where to source the correct driveshafts, yokes, and custom halfshafts needed to complete the conversion. Some of these auxilary parts may become productized by Ronin but I can't speak to those exact details. Rest assured that nothing will be left up in the air.

I will be one of the initial testers for this kit, and as such will be working with the Ronin team to finalize the exact parts list.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on February 20, 2011, 07:28:17 PM
I was hoping my subframe dropping days was gonna come to an end.

Anyways, can we get a break down of what the $1800 consist of?


Dropping the subframe is not that hard. If you have the tools, more than one jack and a couple jackstands you have have it out of the car in 30 minutes.

As a rough list you will need:

02-05 Explorer diff and at minimum the complete Explorer inner CVs
TII outer CVs
Custom halfshafts to mate Explorer inner CVs to TII outer CVs
Driveshaft with proper yokes (this will need to be longer than the C4 driveshaft)
Ronin Explorer Diff mounting kit

You will need to source your own diff and Explorer inners for sure. Ronin will provide the mounting kit and at minimum recommendations of where to source the correct driveshafts, yokes, and custom halfshafts needed to complete the conversion. Some of these auxilary parts may become productized by Ronin but I can't speak to those exact details. Rest assured that nothing will be left up in the air.

I will be one of the initial testers for this kit, and as such will be working with the Ronin team to finalize the exact parts list.

Tip to anybody sourcing there own explorer diff. Cut the drive(dont if you can avoid it) at the front yoke on the truck your getting it from. Your probably going to need about 36 inches of shaft/tube to fab a new drive shaft from the existing shaft. As for CV shafts, if you get the whole CV shaft for this diff, you may save a buck or 2 on remachining the outer splines to fit the mazda CV's. This can be done at alot of local machine shops. But if your like me and nobody in your area can do this,  rcvperformance.com will do the work for you. However, if you plan to run big HP numbers and launch on slicks at say 6K RPM's, then go with the DSS axle packages.

My final assembled drive shaft was 34 inches from U joint center to U joint center. Depending on your trans application/ engine kit this will vary quite a bit. So make sure you get enough material to work with. :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on February 20, 2011, 09:45:46 PM
When we were pulling the diff out from an Explorer for Joel's diff, the driveshaft was a 2 piece unit with a slip joint in the middle. So this wouldn't work for our use, I don't know if other models are different though.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 20, 2011, 11:12:08 PM
Well since Joel isn't answering the questions, I'll answer a couple...

Man, you step away from the computer for a day and a half and folks get antsy. ;)  I guess I'll call that a good thing as it says I'm not the only one excited about this.

-For Darin (346fc3s).  Thanks for the heads up, I'd far rather learn from your experiences (and those of others) than reinvent the wheel.

-Our rear mount can take any type of bushing that fit OEM FC diff mounts.  For the front, we're using a redundant load path so that the factory Ford front bushing is an option.  That said, Ford used a 12 mm bolt to locate things but all the load went vertically directly in the chassis above.  Since we're forced to support this from below, we're putting that bolt in tension.  Part of the desire for a custom front bushing is that we can upsize the hardware to something with a bit more margin.  We're planning to try delrin first to see how it behaves and go to solid aluminum if required.

-Yes you still need to drop the subframe, but like others said that's not hard.  The upside is that you can install the diff prior to the subframe rather than lifting the whole thing as a floppy noddle if you prefer.  The bummer is that you need to pull one or both wheel knuckles since the inner tulips aren't a bolted junction like the mazda bit (at least with the basic ford inners).

-Clearance on vent tube...  Stock is just a barb with a rubber hose to a remote vent.  We think we have enough clearance for this to route like stock but it's fairly tight.  Worse case we'll just shave the mount locally right there.  I didn't want to make the leave out notch any bigger if I didn't have to.

-The explorer drive shaft won't work IF it has a slip yoke eliminator.  My donor car was 4wd so that might be the difference.  If you've got 36" of shaft feel free to use it.  (I just know someone's going to make that a dirty statement...  :secret:)  I'd love to know for sure if this really the difference so if anyone can validate I'd appreciate it.

-Weight: Anthony's guess is reasonable but without having comparative weights for everything (DS, axles, etc) any info we give you now will be incomplete.  I'm of the opinion that it is what it is and it shouldn't be hugely different than stock given the aluminum diff carrier.  Maybe others with similar finished setups can chime what theirs weighed.  Otherwise a full comparison will have to wait until this is truly finished.

-As to the request on price breakdown.  We're planning to provide the mounting, maybe halfshafts (DSS is the fall back option), and maybe a custom front mount.   You'll source a Ford diff & stub axles, Mazda outer CV's plus whatever rear mounts you want to use, and a drive shaft (albeit to our specs).  $1800 is a TARGET but exact details are TBD. 

Rough budget is:
$1200 Ronin kit and halfshafts (as mentioned this may get broken up some)
$250 diff and inner tulips (I paid $122.13 for my Explorer diff, axles, AND a cut chunk of the DS at my local pick a part's 1/2 off day)
$350 driveshaft

BTW, I'm NOT PROMISING we'll hit that target and obviously if you decide you want to run DSS pro level axles that buget is out the window.  I just wanted to give folks a reasonable number to pitch their significant others with...

-Right now our priority is to get the final placement nailed, get the other test units finished and out to testers, make the decision on halfshafts, and get a few of these functional so we can prove this can take some abuse.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 20, 2011, 11:35:10 PM
An initial thought of mine was to use or modify a Mustang or IRS Cobra driveshaft. If anything I would think either of those would need to be shortened, and a 2 piece slip yoke used.

We will find out what options are available once some measurments are taken.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on February 21, 2011, 08:50:47 AM
What is the ETA on the arrival of this kit? Just want to start setting money aside sooner than later  :chug:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 21, 2011, 12:12:50 PM
ETA is a hard question given we need to prove everything works right first.  It's a lot harder to make something production worthy than to build a one off.  That's we try not to post too much info early on.

I'd say early summer if we nail this out of the box but that's not a sure thing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on February 27, 2011, 04:55:06 PM
ETA is a hard question given we need to prove everything works right first.  It's a lot harder to make something production worthy than to build a one off.  That's we try not to post too much info early on.

I'd say early summer if we nail this out of the box but that's not a sure thing.

Developing a product from scratch takes a lot of work. Keep it up. I am looking forward to seeing what the final product looks like.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: gnx7 on March 02, 2011, 02:55:02 PM
That is looking pretty stout!  Liking that for sure....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: HTh3r0 on March 21, 2011, 07:20:43 PM
Nice work so far guys!! I was just talking about how I can't wait for an IRS 8.8 set up for the fc.

If you send me a free one, I promise to abuse the hell out of it for testing/review purposes!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on March 28, 2011, 12:33:11 PM
do-want ... =( 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on March 29, 2011, 08:09:28 PM
Quick update. I have the diff cover trimmed off and the mount fitted to the diff. I am waiting on new bushings from Mazdaspeed and can then fit everything to the car and get the front diff mount welded to the subframe. I bought a set of exploder axles today and will hope to fit everything in this weekend and next week so we will have measurements for driveshaft length. Hopefully the west coast bunch will have measurements for axles soon too.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 29, 2011, 08:12:17 PM
How long are the Explorer axles compared to the FC axles?  Way longer?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 29, 2011, 09:26:42 PM
I should be able to get my diff installed in a couple weeks for mock up. I am thinking about using the Explorer axleshafts and having them resplined for the TurboII outers. I have to have a friend check it out and see if it is worth it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on March 29, 2011, 09:51:38 PM
How long are the Explorer axles compared to the FC axles?  Way longer?

On first glance they look a good bit longer but I have not laid them side by side to compare. They are beefy for sure.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on March 29, 2011, 11:13:04 PM
I should have the final axle measurements tomorrow.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 30, 2011, 10:55:39 AM
Thanks fellas...  Glad to see good progress from our testers.  Anthony we should figure out a time to get together this week.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on March 30, 2011, 12:05:26 PM
Joel, give me a call when you get a chance.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on March 31, 2011, 02:12:06 AM
eta ?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 31, 2011, 11:51:48 AM
eta ?

R&D takes time and I don't want to set false expectations by throwing out a date that's too aggressive nor to dampen hopes by throwing out dates with a lot of margin in them.  Right now we're still in process of getting test cars built up.  Suffice it to say we need to know that this is all we want it to be prior to to releasing the kit.

If you're in a terrible hurry shoot me a PM and we'll look at adding testers (just means what you purchase will be unproven, other than DIY comparables by others)... 

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on April 03, 2011, 12:07:37 AM
Progress report-I got my Mazdaspeed diff bushings on Friday and pressed them in today. Nice fit in the Ronin diff mount. I installed the diff into the chassis and have noted a couple of places that will need to be trimmed to clear the fuel lines but very small issues. the biggest thing I see at this time is that the pinion flange is very close to the subframe. Too close in my opinion. Is there a smaller pinion flange available than the one that comes on the Exploder diff? Did I miss the memo? I'll likely get the front mount welded in on Monday and post pics then. Looks like the driveshaft measurement will be somewhere around 38.5" from diff flange to output shaft. I will remeasure when everything is finallized. Any news on axle measurements?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on April 03, 2011, 12:34:01 AM
I have a T2 axle welded up that is with Joel as of yesterday.

As far as the flange goes we need to either run a pinion yoke or run the smaller T-bird/ Mustang flange which is .75" smaller. But in our car I am going to run a yoke the 1350 yokes measure 3.75" as opposed to the 5" explorer flange.

Anthony
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on April 03, 2011, 01:42:41 PM
Thanks for the input on the pinion flange/yoke. Hopefully we can get a volume break on the axles.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on April 06, 2011, 07:32:11 PM
Found an alternative to the DSS. have NO price Ifon the but hte guy is in Florida!

http://cvaxles.com/index.html (http://cvaxles.com/index.html)

You guys in Florida should check him out! ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on April 08, 2011, 11:14:46 AM
I sent my money yesterday for the mounting kit. Hopefully I should be up and running within a month! I would also be cool with going in for some axles... better than paying the DSS $600 for some :P

What do you guys suppose is the best material to have a driveshaft made out of? I'm only @ ~375WTQ but have bigger plans for next year.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on April 08, 2011, 01:04:30 PM
Progress report-I got my Mazdaspeed diff bushings on Friday and pressed them in today. Nice fit in the Ronin diff mount. I installed the diff into the chassis and have noted a couple of places that will need to be trimmed to clear the fuel lines but very small issues. the biggest thing I see at this time is that the pinion flange is very close to the subframe. Too close in my opinion. Is there a smaller pinion flange available than the one that comes on the Exploder diff? Did I miss the memo? I'll likely get the front mount welded in on Monday and post pics then. Looks like the driveshaft measurement will be somewhere around 38.5" from diff flange to output shaft. I will remeasure when everything is finallized. Any news on axle measurements?

I was looking at the latest pictures of the Ronin mount and noticed that the position of the diff is about 1-1.5" lower compared to my set-ups. I knew that the flange was going to get close to the rear crossmember, so I positioned the diff up as high as possible. This of course requires a slight modification to the fuel lines that run exactly over the top of the diff. This concern should be addressed in the design of the mount, even if slight modifications are required to the flue line routing. As a customer I would much rather move some fuel lines instead of having to remove and replace the pinion flange.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on April 08, 2011, 02:44:04 PM
The orginal design sat about 3/16" - 1/4" higher than these. But this means relocating the fuel line bracket that sits up there. For me that is not an issue since I removed those lines completely. But we can't go any higher do to the raised portions on the diff hitting brake lines and other things up there.

The cobra diff is slightly easier to package in that sense because the case is smaller on the top side vs. the explorer case.

Anthony
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on April 08, 2011, 02:59:07 PM
 ready to go on the testers =)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 08, 2011, 04:22:20 PM
Mockup axle is in route to our axle vendor as we speak. We're be looking to them for recommendations on materials and strength options that folks can scale up or down.

To Andrew's comment, we're pretty confident in our diff placement as the goal was to minimize cutting and on car modifications.  That said, it's looking like the smaller flange and/or pinion yoke is likely.  We don't want to go any higher because axle boots start to interfere with the rear diff mounts and, as mentioned, fuel and brake lines become an issue.  We're also finding some left/right placement variations between cars so that's the second reason to go smaller at the pinion connection.  In some ways this is easier if you just cut it all out.

Charlie just paid for $37 for the smaller pinion flange (thunderbird supercoupe) at his local Ford dealership so that's not terrible. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on April 08, 2011, 06:22:31 PM
Mockup axle is in route to our axle vendor as we speak. We're be looking to them for recommendations on materials and strength options that folks can scale up or down.

To Andrew's comment, we're pretty confident in our diff placement as the goal was to minimize cutting and on car modifications.  That said, it's looking like the smaller flange and/or pinion yoke is likely.  We don't want to go any higher because axle boots start to interfere with the rear diff mounts and, as mentioned, fuel and brake lines become an issue.  We're also finding some left/right placement variations between cars so that's the second reason to go smaller at the pinion connection.  In some ways this is easier if you just cut it all out.

Charlie just paid for $37 for the smaller pinion flange (thunderbird supercoupe) at his local Ford dealership so that's not terrible.

For those that dont mind scrounging around the bone yard, you might find that part for little to no expence! Depending of cource on 1, how honest you are, and 2, how much work your willing to do to save a buck! Its the T bird flange. And if you look for it you may also find the one that fits the Ford Ranger which is a standard Ujoint type yoke, with the little ujoint retainers clamps and 4 bolts. If its an 8.8, it should interchange with no issues! :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on April 08, 2011, 09:31:44 PM
If you are moving the centerline of the axles as they exit the differential either vertically or front to back compared to the stock positions, please watch the angles on the CV joints - especially at full squat.  There could be some binding issues or strength issues due to any increase in those angles.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 09, 2011, 12:01:12 AM
Mockup axle is in route to our axle vendor as we speak. We're be looking to them for recommendations on materials and strength options that folks can scale up or down.

To Andrew's comment, we're pretty confident in our diff placement as the goal was to minimize cutting and on car modifications.  That said, it's looking like the smaller flange and/or pinion yoke is likely.  We don't want to go any higher because axle boots start to interfere with the rear diff mounts and, as mentioned, fuel and brake lines become an issue.  We're also finding some left/right placement variations between cars so that's the second reason to go smaller at the pinion connection.  In some ways this is easier if you just cut it all out.

Charlie just paid for $37 for the smaller pinion flange (thunderbird supercoupe) at his local Ford dealership so that's not terrible.

Tousley Ford may even have that flange cheaper, but $37 is a good price for it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Aaron Venable on April 14, 2011, 04:30:21 PM
Looks good, I'll be going this route when my last TII blows up

I have a couple Q's..

1) What would be the price point for an aluminum rear mount? This, I would like to have.

2) Has an inverted pedestal front mount been considered? Solo, or in conjunction with the existing front mount. It could be made with a flange that matches the body to easily align for welding (hi-tech mspaint document attached). Even permanently fixed, the location looks like it would allow for the Mazda diff to bolt back in. And, with a set of Porsche 930 style cv's and the Ranger yolk, it looks like the diff could be installed/removed with the subframe installed.

(http://i436.photobucket.com/albums/qq81/tvrbo/CIMG30601.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 14, 2011, 04:44:41 PM
I have a couple Q's..

1) What would be the price point for an aluminum rear mount? This, I would like to have.

2) Has an inverted pedestal front mount been considered? Solo, or in conjunction with the existing front mount. It could be made with a flange that matches the body to easily align for welding (hi-tech mspaint document attached). Even permanently fixed, the location looks like it would allow for the Mazda diff to bolt back in. And, with a set of Porsche 930 style cv's and the Ranger yolk, it looks like the diff could be installed/removed with the subframe installed.

Thanks for the kudos and interest.  As to your questions.

1) TBD, if a solid front is required it will mostly likely be included by default.  However, I can't imagine this would be add significantly to the cost.  Part of the reason we haven't released pricing numbers is that we need to be sure we know exactly what the kit contains and how we intend to price potential upgrades.  Focus now is on getting the test cars driving and beating the hell out of this.

2) I like the art  :cheers: makes me smile but gets the point across nicely.  To be honest we didn't really look into top mounting with any great detail.  The issue with it is that we would have to figure out a way to tie into something structural up there and that's not trivial plus it would be harder for folks to index where this goes.  At the end of the day it seemed easier to keep the attachment means generally the way Mazda intended it.  The pinion flange does extend beyond the subframe lip so we'd need to drop the subframe out of the way in either case.

We are captureing the top surface of the mount, we're just doing it with a bolt in bracket (upside down L shape).  Reminds me that I need to shoot a picture of this...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on April 14, 2011, 04:52:22 PM
What about a swapping out the subframe crossbeam for a custom one that goes over the front of the diff instead of under it like the stock one?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Aaron Venable on April 14, 2011, 05:53:21 PM
shoot, you could write a cnc program off that mspaint picture  :)

Now I see what the two fastener locations are for. My biased concern is just in the leverage of the beefy lower mount acting on the clamshell subframe. My suggestion for indexing it would be with the pedestal mounted to the front and the diff mounted up from the rear. Adjust angle, tack, remove diff and finish welding.

The custom subframe is an idea I've entertained for quite a while. There's not alot of room to go over the driveshaft, but I think under could be done quite easily. That's still 10 mounting points to jig up, making for an expensive way to remove the diff without dropping the subframe. I think some strength could be gained using 4130 tubing, I've even drawn out a double a-arm setup all in tubing (not in mspaint), but time and time again, I go back to subframe modification ideas for cost reasons.

keep the ideas coming though (maybe in another thread), but there's definately something here for this "other" bad part of the rx7
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 14, 2011, 07:10:56 PM
What about a swapping out the subframe crossbeam for a custom one that goes over the front of the diff instead of under it like the stock one?

Unfortunately I don't see any way that the added benefit would justify the additional cost for something like this.  We're trying to keep this kit simple and relatively inexpensive so as to be able to reach as broad an audience as possible.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on April 17, 2011, 09:20:44 PM
Driveshaft installation and removal can be facilitated by the use of a two piece transmission yoke. The C3 Corvettes had a similar problem and GM solved it by using such a yoke. Strange makes a nice billet 27 spline yoke that will work with a T56.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on April 22, 2011, 03:15:49 PM
Hey all,

I will be testing the diff setup as well. Any thoughts on proper gears for my setup? I have a T56 and am at around 400RWHP.

I'm thinking I'm gunna do 3.73 gears with the SportTrac LSD... any thoughts? What are most people planning on running? They seem super expensive around here... junkyards have them listed for $300-500. Seems like more than everyone else pays, lol.   :confused:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on April 22, 2011, 03:25:03 PM
i just got my diff in  8.8  rear end 373  i paid  600 through LKQ but it comes with a warranty
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 22, 2011, 06:57:02 PM
Hey all,

I will be testing the diff setup as well. Any thoughts on proper gears for my setup? I have a T56 and am at around 400RWHP.

I'm thinking I'm gunna do 3.73 gears with the SportTrac LSD... any thoughts? What are most people planning on running? They seem super expensive around here... junkyards have them listed for $300-500. Seems like more than everyone else pays, lol.   :confused:

I got mine for 200 shipped. The 3.73s that come in the diff will be a great street gear for a 400WHP car. I will probably end up running 4.10s with mine and a TrueTrac diff because the car will be used mostly on the track, but even 3.73s would run pretty well on the track, or if you run larger tracks it may be a better choice.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: boostjunky on April 23, 2011, 02:40:32 AM
I am very interested in this kit once it is completed. I have a fully built stroked LS1 in my car now and the rear end is virtually the only thing left stock in my car (surprised it has even held this long) It's starting to make some noise now and I'm pretty sure it's going to commit suicide this summer. Would love to have this as a viable option to put an 8.8 in as I am quite mechanically inclined but do not have the resources to fabricate something like this up on my own. Seems like a good solution for me.

Do you have any sort of ballpark completion date? I read through the thread and didn't see any mention of it

-Jeff A.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 23, 2011, 12:03:56 PM
All the beta testers should be on the road within a couple months. Ronin is working with the beta testers to get everything figured out (axle options, driveshaft options, yokes, etc.) to make this a very easy upgrade that you don't have to wait for parts to complete. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 23, 2011, 11:20:04 PM
ETA is always a hard question for R&D projects but barring any major issues best guess would be this summer for a wide release.  We don't want to release something before we have full confidence in it so if we find something we want to change delays are always a possibility. 

That said, we've added a few folks to our tester group recently who preferred not to wait for the production version.  We don't need any more given the spectrum of cars we have signed up but that's an option for others if you don't mind getting something "pre-production" that hasn't been formally proven yet.  Contact me via PM directly if you can't wait.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on April 24, 2011, 09:41:52 PM
I have all my welding and fitment completed. Waiting on axles and to have a driveshaft built. I am currently running a carbonfiber shaft but will test fit with a steel shaft until everything proves to work well and will then have a carbon shaft made. I am using the Mazdaspeed bushings on the diff and crossmember and the fit on the diff mount was very good.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on April 24, 2011, 10:26:48 PM
I have all my welding and fitment completed. Waiting on axles and to have a driveshaft built. I am currently running a carbonfiber shaft but will test fit with a steel shaft until everything proves to work well and will then have a carbon shaft made. I am using the Mazdaspeed bushings on the diff and crossmember and the fit on the diff mount was very good.

Good to hear! I just took my rear out and fixed an issue with pushing oil out while driving. I have an extra  X member and thanks to Ray, I now have an exploder housing. tho its empty.

My rear diff mount was base off the 8.8 rock crawler type diff cover from balistic fabrication.com . I built my own setup, but one thing I had to over come was the diff wanted to push all the fluid out while running down th road. So today I made a deflector plate to fit the inside of the diff. 20 minutes of running on jackstands at 1500 rpm's in OD showed no more leakage. I'm HAPPY! :D

I'm really interested in this setup tho, because I have all but the axles to set up another explorer diff. Only thing I need is axles stubbs an the diff cover and I got another 8.8 setup ready! I'm thinking about a spool for all out drag racing. I would really like balls to the wall results from all who took the risk on this! I'm all about supporting the guys on this forum and Joel and the boys are really putting a good effort out on this! :D

Alass, I M POOR! ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 09, 2011, 03:55:37 PM
Gents, a minor status update:

-First article half shafts axles are being built now.  Charlie's install is furthest along so we're going to triple check the fit on his car before turning on production for the other testers.  We did cut and spice a factory t2 bar to explorer inner thereby making a mockup axle at the correct resultant length so they really should nail it first try.  Still we think it's better safe than sorry to be sure they're right.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/aDSC_1000Medium.JPG)

-Testers already know this but for everyone else's benefit the halfshaft we're recommending is a heat treated 4340 bar (300m is a variant of 4340) that makes the transition to the Mazda T2 outer within the bar.  We talked over the pros and cons of a transition within the outer CV however increasing the splines size will weaken the mating part so it becomes a null sum game.

The plan is to have halfshaft bars and boots included by default with the Ronin kit.    8)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MPbdy on May 09, 2011, 04:40:58 PM
Quote
that makes the transition to the Mazda T2 outer within the bar.

So the bar is splined for the explorer inner and T2 outer?

Did you source the 4340 bar already splined or are you having that done somewhere?

Would these half shafts work with other 28 spline 8.8 IRS center sections like an iron Tbird housing for example?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 10, 2011, 05:29:00 PM
Per Andrew Borodin I believe the bar splines are different but I haven't verified the permutations.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on May 10, 2011, 05:36:50 PM
Per Andrew Borodin I believe the bar splines are different but I haven't verified the permutations.

To clarify, I have observed a different bar spline on the Explorer as compared to the Cobra (where the bar mates with the inner CV tri-pod). I know nothing about 28 spline T-bird rear ends, other than they have a cast iron case and have the same shape as the Cobra housing.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on May 11, 2011, 09:45:19 PM
Per Andrew Borodin I believe the bar splines are different but I haven't verified the permutations.

To clarify, I have observed a different bar spline on the Explorer as compared to the Cobra (where the bar mates with the inner CV tri-pod). I know nothing about 28 spline T-bird rear ends, other than they have a cast iron case and have the same shape as the Cobra housing.

Andrew

This I can say. My T Bird SC rear has DSS axles. The tripods from my CV cups fit nicely into the explorer cups. I dont have the explorer's to compare again to get measurements for you guys, but Ray brought a pair up once and we slipped my T Bird SC tripods in and they appear to be SO CLOSE to the same, I'll go out on a limb and say they are. ;)

The guy I bought my center bars from was running a cobra rear. He was on the old forum and kept breaking the mazda outer CV's so he upgraded to the 2K axle set from DSS. My T bird stuff slipped right on with out any issues. So I'm willing to bet the tripods are all the same. The real difference is spline count and the explorer seal surface. Cobras are simular to T birds in design only 31 spline. Explorers are simular to cobras, only the seal surface is different.

If there is a difference between the 3 CV tripods, its only in the splines. the cups are the same design as my T bird cups. But that doesnt mean that different Gen's of explorer's are all the same either. I just cant see Ford retooling all that production to change such a small part on any car. Its just not logical in my book. BUT I COULD BE WRONG! ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on May 11, 2011, 09:46:50 PM
 By the way, I have a couple extra T Bird tripods if you'd like to compare. PM me, and I'll send one over Joel! :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 12, 2011, 07:51:48 PM
Hey Willy,

For the purpose of forum knowledge I'd be glad to do a comparison for you.  If it works out so the halfshaft bars are the same I assume we can sell those to folks who want to do their own mounting with a T-bird setup.  That said, I should also warn you that Ronin is looking to offer as complete a setup as we can with one configuration (explorer) but thus far we're probably not going to be supporting all the permutations of setup conceivably possible.

Either way knowledge is good so I sent you a PM with my address.
-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on May 12, 2011, 08:11:17 PM
I'll see if I can get it out to ya this weekend. I too would like to know one way or the other. ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on May 13, 2011, 06:05:59 PM
SHIPPED! :D

Do me a favor tho, what ever you find Joel? link it here too. http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=5480.0 (http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=5480.0)

This way everyone can read it. 8)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on May 21, 2011, 09:01:50 AM
How is the axle development coming? I got my diff mount, now all I need is a diff, axles, driveshaft, and CVs  :chug:

Looking to order the axles and CVs asap  8)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: TII_Arekusu on May 21, 2011, 01:32:03 PM
As now I'm on my second used TII diff, I am interested in this mounting system. Do you happen to have a vague ETA for the carrier being produced alone? I'm weighing my options to either rebuild my TII diff to stock specs.. or wait it out for this fine looking piece of fab. work.

Alex
Title: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fc3sls3 on May 21, 2011, 02:40:38 PM
I am interested in the end result. The only down side with the explorer diff is the aluminum housing. I built a ford 8.8 swap in my fc last year. It uses the t-bird housing because of the extra mounting tabs and the much stronger cast iron case. I will say your setup looks pretty good. The only thing I am wondering is how the wheel hop issues will pan out. I can post pics of the setup I built. The ford explorer diff is only good for 500 whp range. The cases are known for exploding apart under wheel hop. I have street drove and track tested my setup. The diff setup I built can handle well over 800 whp.
Title: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fc3sls3 on May 21, 2011, 02:53:01 PM
The cobra 31 spline tripods are the way to go, but the availability is hard to get! I have compared all of them, all that is different is the splines. All the diffs are identical internally. I am running the 31 spline Detroit tru trac.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Rayminator on May 21, 2011, 03:14:19 PM
 The ford explorer diff is only good for 500 whp range. The cases are known for exploding apart under wheel hop. I have street drove and track tested my setup. The diff setup I built can handle well over 800 whp.
[/quote]

Interesting...did you get this information from an Explorer website? The aluminum Explorer housing, appears much stronger than the aluminum housing on the Cobra or Lincoln set-up.

Who is running an Explorer rearend that is having axle hop issues? There is only one FC that I know of, that has the aluminum Explorer IRS installed, with miles on it. It was done several years back.

 FYI, I have an Iron T-Bird housing, with Explorer 31 spline internals, that Willy assembled, for future use. I think that it will be a very good combination.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on May 21, 2011, 05:24:48 PM
The ford explorer diff is only good for 500 whp range. The cases are known for exploding apart under wheel hop. I have street drove and track tested my setup. The diff setup I built can handle well over 800 whp.

Interesting...did you get this information from an Explorer website? The aluminum Explorer housing, appears much stronger than the aluminum housing on the Cobra or Lincoln set-up.

Who is running an Explorer rearend that is having axle hop issues? There is only one FC that I know of, that has the aluminum Explorer IRS installed, with miles on it. It was done several years back.

 FYI, I have an Iron T-Bird housing, with Explorer 31 spline internals, that Willy assembled, for future use. I think that it will be a very good combination.
[/quote]

Yup! its on the shelf Ray! ;)

As for the wheel hop issue? My 8.8 T Bird has none. One must consider that wheel hop is a product of moving parts that arent supposed to move. Poly bushings, rear steer eliminators, and strong enough axles, and decent struts all go along ways to stopping wheel hop. Even wheel bearings can cause some of it. But when you put all these piece together considering my car is 25 years old, wheel hop is bound to be there. I did all of this and now I have zero wheel hop.

JMHO, by the time you install an 8.8 (which ever route you go) your going to eliminate half of the list of things that cause the wheel hop anyway. So to finish it off for good, I'd do the poly bushings, steering eliminators, and just make sure you got decent struts. The rest will be cured during the swap.

When all thats done, well then its HAMMER TIME! :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on May 22, 2011, 12:08:36 AM
I am interested in the end result. The only down side with the explorer diff is the aluminum housing. I built a ford 8.8 swap in my fc last year. It uses the t-bird housing because of the extra mounting tabs and the much stronger cast iron case. I will say your setup looks pretty good. The only thing I am wondering is how the wheel hop issues will pan out. I can post pics of the setup I built. The ford explorer diff is only good for 500 whp range. The cases are known for exploding apart under wheel hop. I have street drove and track tested my setup. The diff setup I built can handle well over 800 whp.

Show me an Explorer case that has exploded due to wheel hop, or one that has failed because it been subjected to 500 WHP.

If your car wheel hops there is a very simple solution to avoid breaking parts - let off the gas. As stated above, new or solid diff, subframe and suspension mount will all help keep the car from wheelhopping.

The Explorer cas was used because it is easier to mount, and the alumnium keeps the weight down. The iron Tbird diff is not needed for its strengh.
Title: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fc3sls3 on May 22, 2011, 01:23:57 AM
Search the web. The ford 8.8 IRS diff is a common swap for a lot of IRS cars. Honestly the weight savings you will not notice. Aluminum cases are known for splitting apart. Look at the fd, ctsv, cobra, vettes. I work at a shop were I work on setups like this all the time. Wheel hop is a harmonic in the drive train. On vettes and FDs guys are trying to brace the crap out of their diffs to help stiffen the cases up. I also run the LPW diff cover to help preload the diff caps as well. You can argue with me to the end of days. I am just saying I have seen it happen a lot. You can take the info I posted or choose not to. I am not saying what you are doing is wrong, but for the cost you can build a diff that is much stronger for the same price.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Rayminator on May 22, 2011, 07:13:40 AM
I am interested in the end result. The only down side with the explorer diff is the aluminum housing. I built a ford 8.8 swap in my fc last year. It uses the t-bird housing because of the extra mounting tabs and the much stronger cast iron case. I will say your setup looks pretty good. The only thing I am wondering is how the wheel hop issues will pan out. I can post pics of the setup I built. The ford explorer diff is only good for 500 whp range. The cases are known for exploding apart under wheel hop. I have street drove and track tested my setup. The diff setup I built can handle well over 800 whp.

Please post the photos you have, of your 8.8 IRS swap.
There have been several ways, to anchor the front mounting tabs . Thanks.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on May 22, 2011, 11:18:25 AM
Search the web. The ford 8.8 IRS diff is a common swap for a lot of IRS cars. Honestly the weight savings you will not notice. Aluminum cases are known for splitting apart. Look at the fd, ctsv, cobra, vettes. I work at a shop were I work on setups like this all the time. Wheel hop is a harmonic in the drive train. On vettes and FDs guys are trying to brace the crap out of their diffs to help stiffen the cases up. I also run the LPW diff cover to help preload the diff caps as well. You can argue with me to the end of days. I am just saying I have seen it happen a lot. You can take the info I posted or choose not to. I am not saying what you are doing is wrong, but for the cost you can build a diff that is much stronger for the same price.

We aren't talking about FD, Vette or CTS V cases here.

I have a high horsepower 04 Cobra and lots of 8.8 experience. The cases rarley if ever break in their OEM configurations. If they do it is because someone did not know how to let off the gas during wheel hop. They break in aftermarket configurations because they are not mounted correctly.
 
The cover is a different story, but that is not a factor in this conversion.
Title: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fc3sls3 on May 22, 2011, 01:59:07 PM
Like I said, I dont want to argue over this or that. I am simply stating the tbird case is much stronger. And with wheel hop, all it takes is one quick bang. Even if you let off, it happens so fast damage will be done. It is great to see these other kits designed tho. It will save some headaches for others.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on May 22, 2011, 10:47:53 PM
Like I said, I dont want to argue over this or that. I am simply stating the tbird case is much stronger. And with wheel hop, all it takes is one quick bang. Even if you let off, it happens so fast damage will be done. It is great to see these other kits designed tho. It will save some headaches for others.

All of these discussions have been covered ad nauseum, in other parts of the forum, and do not need to be brought up in this thread.
 
Yes the Tbird case is stronger cheaper and heavier. That really is of no bearing. That case cannot be used with this kit.

If mounted correctly the 8.8 alumnium diffs take a TON of abuse. The Cobra housing has been proven by many members of this board, and repeatedly in the Cobra community. A couple FD RX7 guys have broken alumnium cases, and it is because of lack of support above the front mount. Those were not Ronin Mounting kits, and the failures were not caused by wheel hop.

The front mount support issues are addressed in the Ronin kit. If it going to break, one of the beta testers (myself included) will find a way to break it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on May 23, 2011, 11:33:10 AM
If I'm looking on a site like Car-Part... this is what I want to look for, correct?

"Rear Axle, 4 Dr, exc. Sport Trac; diff mtd ABS sensor, 3.73 ratio, LSD "

Assuming I want 3.73 gears which, of course, I do.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on May 23, 2011, 12:37:08 PM
Comment removed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on May 23, 2011, 06:40:19 PM
If I'm looking on a site like Car-Part... this is what I want to look for, correct?

"Rear Axle, 4 Dr, exc. Sport Trac; diff mtd ABS sensor, 3.73 ratio, LSD "

Assuming I want 3.73 gears which, of course, I do.

Yea that is it. You do not want 06+, the case is different.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 24, 2011, 01:20:55 PM
Fellas, let's keep it track.  Some of the above discussion is not helpful.  Specifically:  Please no classifieds regarding competing setups in our sub forum.  Unsubstantiated rumors about the strength of various setups doesn't benefit discussion of this kit either.   We're focusing on one solution here (explorer) for reasons discussed at length above.  Of course there are other solutions, but this is what we're doing.  If you want to accept the compromises of weight and extra headaches packaging a t-bird setup feel free to do your own thing (but do it elsewhere).

That said, if you have real design feedback that would HELP our efforts send me a PM with commentary and/or links to comparable failures.  The only 8.8 alum failures we know of are related to cover support (at least until serious HP levels go comes into play).  We have multiple test cars in progress and we're going to beat the hell out of out this kit to be sure it's stout.  This should be plenty to prove what it takes to avoid wheel hop. 

For those interested in progress, who're being told that Charlie should have first article axles in hand this week.  That said, our axle vendor's responsiveness to inquires leaves something to be desired so that's not a sure thing...  (Lacking customer service is another reason to batch order these, as we don't want each and every future customer dealing with the same headaches Charlie and I are taking care of for you).

As soon as we have those validated we'll place the order for the rest of our tester's axles and take final DS measurements.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on May 24, 2011, 05:28:44 PM
Hey Joel, you get my parts?

And/or did you get a chance to compare tripods?

Just wondering. ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 24, 2011, 08:21:39 PM
Will,

Yes, the tripod is here.  Other than opening it up I haven't done anything in the way of formal comparisons yet.  I'll get to it, but it may take me a bit.  Seems like I have more balls in the air than just the normal juggle these days.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on June 03, 2011, 07:15:03 PM
Will,

Yes, the tripod is here.  Other than opening it up I haven't done anything in the way of formal comparisons yet.  I'll get to it, but it may take me a bit.  Seems like I have more balls in the air than just the normal juggle these days.

-Joel

Well then its time to join the circus Joel, lol! ;)

I know you got to much stuff going on, but since I announced that your going to do this comparison thingy, I'm getting nagged lol. :)

So as to NOT be a nag! Yeah right! With the holidays and all, I'm sure this is at the top of your list, yes? :scratch: :D

I'm such an ass huh? :)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on June 12, 2011, 12:36:55 PM
Joel,

I was so happy when I saw this thread! Ive got a Cusco LSD on the stock JDM T2 4.30 rear gear ratio (From my 20b build) . I'm still building the car but I have been concerned with the high ratio the whole time. This looks like the solution to my problem!! Can't wait for the kit to come out.....

Neil
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on June 14, 2011, 01:34:49 PM
any updates on the axles .
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 14, 2011, 04:07:15 PM
Mostly just getting really tired of dealing with this axle vendor. 
We've been promised the first set for about 3 consecutive weeks now.  Between Charlie and myself we must have 30 phone calls in to these guys.

Charlie was the last one to get through and he tells me he's cautiously optomistic we might actually see them this week. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on June 14, 2011, 08:20:39 PM
it's actually more like 13,542 phone calls but actually feel like I may see something very soon.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: HTh3r0 on June 19, 2011, 01:08:51 AM
Will Ronin be selling a full package deal? Instead of me personally sourcing a diff, axles and what not.
Like you could either sell just your mounting kit or you could sell the entire bolt up and ready to roll deal.

Curious as I definitely want to buy an IRS 8.8 set up but I dont really have much time to check car yards for certain year explorers and contacting different places about custom axles. Just want a pay for it, install it deal.

: )
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 20, 2011, 04:11:00 PM
We want to make this as easy on customers as possible but we're unlikely to go into the diff business.  They're a huge pain to ship and easily available on ebay or the various wrecking yard request websites.  The other one we likely won't do is DS simply because there are too many purmatuations possible.

We are planning to offer halfshafts.  The good news on that score is that first articles have finally arrived!

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/axles_001Large.jpg)

The less good news is that I really dislike the placement of the snap ring grooves inboard of the splines at both ends.  Looks like it's time to open up my spares and see what options we have.  I'm not looking forward to the process if we decided we need to place special requests given how long it took to get these.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fox4life on June 20, 2011, 10:08:35 PM
Well thats progress at least. Forgive my ignorance on the subject, but whats the issue with the snap ring grooves where they are currently located compared to where you would like to have them?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 21, 2011, 03:46:59 PM
It's just a stress riser...  Quick changes in section raise the local stress so it breaks in fatigue.  Halfshafts see about the worst fatigue of any component on the car.  Carroll Smith does a good job of explaining this in "Engineer to Win".  (Great book by the way)

http://books.google.com/books?id=JyAZO6vGaTcC&lpg=PA135&ots=qHQ6gvfBNq&dq=carroll%20smith%20splines%20dumb&pg=PA120#v=onepage&q&f=false (http://books.google.com/books?id=JyAZO6vGaTcC&lpg=PA135&ots=qHQ6gvfBNq&dq=carroll%20smith%20splines%20dumb&pg=PA120#v=onepage&q&f=false)

One the inboard side we'll likely be fine given the shaft diameter is so large (it does mean that the added diameter is extra weight with not much benefit but we can live with that). 

On the outboard CV, the stress riser looks like it's also the minimum section.  That's bad news if it can be avoided.  I'm questioning whether we could build in a bearing shoulder or otherwise improve the design.

http://books.google.com/books?id=JyAZO6vGaTcC&lpg=PA135&ots=qHQ6gvfBNq&dq=carroll%20smith%20splines%20dumb&pg=PA115#v=onepage&q&f=false (http://books.google.com/books?id=JyAZO6vGaTcC&lpg=PA135&ots=qHQ6gvfBNq&dq=carroll%20smith%20splines%20dumb&pg=PA115#v=onepage&q&f=false)

The bars from vendor come with a lifetime warratee but given the customer service we've had to date I don't want folks counting on that.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on June 24, 2011, 07:04:59 PM
Hey Joel, read your comparrison in my thread. Thanks for puting it there.

My mind is open, and I have no problems with the comparrison other then I think the number PI was not included in the measurements.

Please correct me if I'm wrong! ;)

Again, you are the first to compare these, so, I want to be right more then you! :P
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on June 29, 2011, 09:25:13 PM
Hey guys, just a heads up. I finished the install last night and got an aluminum driveshaft built this morning and installed it this afternoon. I used a 2 piece front yoke and the install went fine. My pal alan stopped by the shop yesterday afternoon about 5 and we jumped on it together and knocked it out. The whole job from taking out the stock TII diff and subframe to installing the Ronin Exploder diff and axles took 2.5 hours and then I spent another hour today installing the driveshaft and re-installing the exhaust and torquing all the fasteners.

I have not had the alignment set yet and will on Friday morning but that didn't stop me from taking it out for a short test drive. At this point everything seems very good and probably as quiet as stock. I nailed it on a roll a few times and did not get any wheel hop in places that I would have before. I have the car back on the lift to nut/bolt and double check tomorrow and I will get the alignment done and drive a bunch this weekend so that I can give some real driving impressions.

Overall at this point I am very pleased with the results and am looking forward to getting on the interstate and see how my new 3.55 gear feels. I am running the M12 GTO t56 at this time but will be switching over to an Fbody T56 with REM polished gears  which I think will make it even better.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: TII_Arekusu on June 30, 2011, 03:04:46 AM
Sweet!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on June 30, 2011, 09:19:50 AM
Awesome. I'm ready to order  :drive:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bergls1 on June 30, 2011, 11:39:33 AM
Like Charlie, I am also using the Mazdaspeed rubber bushings. I went from a solid mount to these on a Cobra 8.8 and the difference is really dramatic. I haven't noticed any wheel hop being introduced, although I'm probably not hooking up as hard as some of you on my 225 width tires. IMO, unless you have a serious strip/track car, I would start with the Mazdaspeed bushings. Take Care, Berg
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 30, 2011, 07:12:12 PM
FYI:  I removed a couple posts at both users requests...

ForceFed, no hard feeling from us as to exploring other options, however Andrew is correct that as a vendor we're pursuing one route only as we think this one is the best bang for the buck and the best option for creating a near bolt in system.

In other news I have to say, I had a conversation with Charlie this afternoon that pretty much made my day...  Can't wait to have him chime in with his experience with the first running Ronin diff kit.     :lurk:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on June 30, 2011, 07:26:08 PM
Like Charlie, I am also using the Mazdaspeed rubber bushings. I went from a solid mount to these on a Cobra 8.8 and the difference is really dramatic. I haven't noticed any wheel hop being introduced, although I'm probably not hooking up as hard as some of you on my 225 width tires. IMO, unless you have a serious strip/track car, I would start with the Mazdaspeed bushings. Take Care, Berg

I found the same thing with my T bird swap guys. I run 245/50/16's in the rear, I cant hook for the life of me, but wheel hop is all gone! Good tires will change things though. I run energy poly's throughout, and stock mount bushings in the X member and the rear bat wing.

I have ZERO, NADDA, wheel hop, but lighting the tires up for as long as I choose isnt getting me far lol.

The truth be told, I have absolutely no worries of wheel hop, or breaking an axle. But LSx is stock at the moment too. I run a 4L60E trans stock, I can blow the tires off at 30MPH and never get an ounce of wheel hop.

Stock outer CV's are the last week link in my setup. So far, no issues with those either.

If you make bigger power and buy the DSS axles, I'd say your pretty damned bullet proof!

8.8 is night and day from the T 2 rear! Whatever gear you chose!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on June 30, 2011, 08:03:34 PM
This story starts off sounding a little disappointing but trust me, it ends REALLY WELL!

Still have not gotten an alignment but that'll happen in the am tomorrow. I drove the car this morning and it tracks straight and felt stable so I decided it was good enought to drive to lunch. Well, my impressions after lunch were not great as I felt some vibrations and resonance that I didn't like at all and definitely needed to be looked at so my lunch drive was really uneventful.

Now it gets good. I put the car back on the lift to have a look around and figured that any rubbing, hitting, etc. would be evident because everything having to do with the install is newly painted. Fact is there is no evidence of anything contacting anything but the noise/vibration/resonance I experienced reminded me of when a stock front diff mount breaks or is starting to break. This led me to have a look at the front diff mount bolt. The one I used was just barely long enough and I did not use any type of nylock nut on it. I did ighten it when I did the install  but did not hit it with the torque wrench and paint pen like I normally do. I likely did just an initial tightening and never looked at it again and it had loosened up enough to become noisy. I found a longer bolt and some thick washers as well as a locknut and tightened everything down.

Now for a test drive. Let me first say that I have never been much of the burnout type because everything I have ever had wheelhopped so bad that it just wasn't any fun to do so it was avoided. That is now a thing of the past! My car left the following signature in the street: 2 long black stripes (1rst gear) pause, 2 more long black stripes (2nd gear) pause, and 2 more long black stripes (3rd gear). From there I went out for a bit of open road testing and became even more impressed. It is smooth, quiet, and with 3.55 gears is no longer like driving a dumptruck or tractor due to gearing.

I love this conversion and humbly salute all that have contributed to it's development. I especially want to thank Joel for the engineering, Ray for hooking me up on the diff, and Berg for the gear set. I will continue to monitor everything for awhile and make sure that it all stays where it belongs. I am confident that this is going to be a long lasting conversion and that it makes an already great car even more betterer (seems like a fitting description!)

I'll try and pop some pics this weekend and maybe some video if I can find the gopro camera.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 30, 2011, 11:08:48 PM
A burnout through three gears with no sign of wheel hop what so ever...  I think it works.   Charlie's also running rubber bushings at all there connection points.  Frankly out makes me wonder if there's any need to go solid.  We'll still test it to say we did but this is damn promising....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 01, 2011, 12:15:04 AM
Cant wait to get mine in and my car going!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Rayminator on July 01, 2011, 06:33:54 AM
Great work men. How about a video of Charlie doing a long smokey burnout.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bergls1 on July 01, 2011, 09:44:56 AM
A burnout through three gears with no sign of wheel hop what so ever...  I think it works.   Charlie's also running rubber bushings at all there connection points.  Frankly out makes me wonder if there's any need to go solid.  We'll still test it to say we did but this is damn promising....
I would think keeping the one big front mount solid would be good as you have isolation from the body at the cross member mounts. Somthing I tried was filling the rear crossmember with 3m rigid piller foam. I can't really say if it had any affect of quieting down any noise through the front mount(s) because all of my changes were done at one time. Needless to say, this (the 8.8 conversion) is the best thing you will ever do your FC...the gearing really transforms the car. Every guy who can swing this should try it! Take Care, Berg
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on July 01, 2011, 05:58:36 PM
A burnout through three gears with no sign of wheel hop what so ever...  I think it works.   Charlie's also running rubber bushings at all there connection points.  Frankly out makes me wonder if there's any need to go solid.  We'll still test it to say we did but this is damn promising....

Time to nail down the final numbers Joel! :bacon:

Ramp up production and get over to the club and become a sponser if your not already. I'm sure those guys will really want the 8.8 swap kit with the monster torque they make with the rotory.  ;)

Hell, maybe borrow Blue Rabbiits old motor and see if you can get the IRS ET record from the club! :bacon:

 :yay:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 01, 2011, 06:01:06 PM
I will definately be running a fully solid mount setup.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on July 01, 2011, 06:54:01 PM
If we wanted to take the IRS ET record, I am sure the 408ci LS2 with a pair of 76mm turbos that is sitting on a shelf at my work would be more than enough.......
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 01, 2011, 08:23:01 PM
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.  We all know (or should know  :poke:) that what's on the shelf at work doesn't matter and there's a lot more to chasing records than just big horsepower and one car that burns out much smoother than the factory.  Too many guys around here have been taken to task for calling out theorical performance so please don't fall into that trap. 

For the moment, I'm just happy that initial results are so favorable.  My focus now is going to be getting all the testers up and running in several other configurations (forced induction, road race, etc) before we move into production.  Avoiding wheel hop is a HUGE deal for having IRS the system live but I want to be sure this can be replicated consistently. 

All that said, I'll say that this kit has me excited about taking my car apart yet again and that hasn't been true for quite a while.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on July 01, 2011, 08:29:26 PM
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.  We all know (or should know  :poke:) that what's on the shelf at work doesn't matter and there's a lot more to chasing records than just big horsepower and one car that burns out much smoother than the factory.  Too many guys around here have been taken to task for calling out theorical performance so please don't fall into that trap. 

For the moment, I'm just happy that initial results are so favorable.  My focus now is going to be getting all the testers up and running in several other configurations (forced induction, road race, etc) before we move into production.  Avoiding wheel hop is a HUGE deal for having IRS the system live but I want to be sure this can be replicated consistently. 

All that said, I'll say that this kit has me excited about taking my car apart yet again and that hasn't been true for quite a while.

No guts, No glory!  :P

Stop overthinking your desings! ;) Your smarter then that lol. ::)

Your only weekness in that explore is the bearing caps in the diff.  8)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 02, 2011, 01:20:58 AM
The mounting design should allow the use of a diff cover with cap reinforcement screws. The explorer cover is pretty tall, taller than most aftermarket covers.

Billet steel caps are also available, and as far as I know can be used in the IRS pumpkins.

The only thing I am concerned about from a road race perspective is the diff temp, but that is not a function of the mount or the kit itself.

As Joel said, the big deal is the lack of wheelhop. This is especially pleasing considering that Charlie is still using 3 rubber mounts, and from what I remember he is not running extremely sticky tires, or a firm strut and spring package. If that proves to be the case, this will be a VERY streetable setup, with lower levels of NVH for the guys with street oriented cars.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on July 02, 2011, 03:21:59 PM
I am using a pretty soft setup for sure. AGX shocks with Racing Beat Convertible springs on BFG G Force Sport tires 235/45/17. Diff mount rubber is Mazdaspeed, front mount is stock Ford. I have around 100 miles on it now and the GF drove it last night for the first time and is scared to death of it (perfect!). Spent a good bit of time on interstate yesterday and it is as quiet as stock.
By the way, the cover says 75w90 gear oil but Ford recommends 75w140 so I went with Redline.

I have no temps measured but can say that when re raced the FC's in ITS we ran 5.12 gears on stock GXL limited slip and later Miata Torsen and never killed a diff. I changed fluid after every event and the diff never let us down. Granted, torque was not a facto but rpm's were as the engine was turned to 9200. I am a big believer in frequent fluid changes for track use.




The mounting design should allow the use of a diff cover with cap reinforcement screws. The explorer cover is pretty tall, taller than most aftermarket covers.

Billet steel caps are also available, and as far as I know can be used in the IRS pumpkins.

The only thing I am concerned about from a road race perspective is the diff temp, but that is not a function of the mount or the kit itself.

As Joel said, the big deal is the lack of wheelhop. This is especially pleasing considering that Charlie is still using 3 rubber mounts, and from what I remember he is not running extremely sticky tires, or a firm strut and spring package. If that proves to be the case, this will be a VERY streetable setup, with lower levels of NVH for the guys with street oriented cars.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on July 02, 2011, 08:01:43 PM
Let's not get ahead of ourselves.  We all know (or should know  :poke:) that what's on the shelf at work doesn't matter and there's a lot more to chasing records than just big horsepower and one car that burns out much smoother than the factory.  Too many guys around here have been taken to task for calling out theorical performance so please don't fall into that trap. 

For the moment, I'm just happy that initial results are so favorable.  My focus now is going to be getting all the testers up and running in several other configurations (forced induction, road race, etc) before we move into production.  Avoiding wheel hop is a HUGE deal for having IRS the system live but I want to be sure this can be replicated consistently. 

All that said, I'll say that this kit has me excited about taking my car apart yet again and that hasn't been true for quite a while.


Joel, I know what your talking about. Baby steps lol, right? :P

I also have had my 8.8 to the track playing in lacrosse. I can tell you, you made a big leap forward! ;)

Its a night and day difference in the car. Yes, tuning the suspension is an art, but starting with something bullet proof is the basis for "tuning the suspension". You got the "big leap" in design. Its practicle, its going to prove its strength, and with good gears, good tunable struts, and a decent tire, you can take that title from Enzo. :D

Hell, I'll pitch in for the sponsership! Anybody else? :P
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 02, 2011, 08:34:36 PM
I am using a pretty soft setup for sure. AGX shocks with Racing Beat Convertible springs on BFG G Force Sport tires 235/45/17. Diff mount rubber is Mazdaspeed, front mount is stock Ford. I have around 100 miles on it now and the GF drove it last night for the first time and is scared to death of it (perfect!). Spent a good bit of time on interstate yesterday and it is as quiet as stock.
By the way, the cover says 75w90 gear oil but Ford recommends 75w140 so I went with Redline.

I have no temps measured but can say that when re raced the FC's in ITS we ran 5.12 gears on stock GXL limited slip and later Miata Torsen and never killed a diff. I changed fluid after every event and the diff never let us down. Granted, torque was not a facto but rpm's were as the engine was turned to 9200. I am a big believer in frequent fluid changes for track use.

I agree, absolutely use 75w140 or 85w140 in the IRS Ford diff no matter what you plan to do with the car, street or track. Definately change the diff fluid regularly for track duties. In my Cobra I see diff temps as high as 270 degrees on the track, and that is not on race tires. It can easily get over 300 degrees with more grip in a Cobra application. I wrapped my exhaust pipes with header wrap as they passed under the rear subframe in my Cobra and the diff temps dropped 20 degrees.

Obviously the Cobra is a much different application, and is a heavier car with lots more torque than even a modded LS powered FC, and the exhaust is literally right under the differential. I expect to have less of a problem with the 8.8 in the FC, if there is even a problem at all. Considering that the rear mount itself is now a massive heatsink, and the exhaust does not pass 2 inches under the diff, and the diff itself is mounted low in the car and should be able to get some fresh air, I am not extremely concerned. That said I will have a diff temp gauge onboard and will keep everyone appraised of what I find out on the track.

For those that don't want to invest in a diff temp gauge, just check the temp of the diff case with an infared thermometer after your sessions to get a feel for how hot it is getting. If you ever start smelling gear oil, you have probably overheated the diff and it has puked oil out of the vent tube.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fox4life on July 04, 2011, 04:59:06 PM
Hey everyone, just wanted to let you guys know what I found when I installed the cradle and diff yesterday.

- had to grind down the area on the cradle for the racingbeat swaybar I'm running. (just like was mentioned before)
- I had a 1350 yoke put on my 8.8 when it was rebuilt, and even though it is smaller than the factory explorer flange, it still didn't clear the subframe. I just ground down/ dented in that area of the subframe and it now has about 1/2 inch of clearance. (is this enough?)

Even after all that it still only took me a few hours by myself to install. The front mount was super easy to locate and weld, and everything else lined up and bolted in like a charm. Very nice pieces. So as of now I'm just waiting on the halfshafts, and driveshaft measurements so I can order one. Im getting little-kid-like excited to drive this thing. Lol.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on July 04, 2011, 07:20:18 PM
Which yoke did you use ? A mark williams, strange, or a ford racing ?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fox4life on July 04, 2011, 08:36:09 PM
Which yoke did you use ? A mark williams, strange, or a ford racing ?

Ford racing I believe. I could double check, but I'm 99% sure.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on July 04, 2011, 09:21:25 PM
[quote author=fox4life link=topic=5084.msg100730#msg100730 date=130981

I went with a 2 piece front yoke and the old style Mustang GT pinion flange and have good clearance. I have 3 different rear bars and am running the thinnest one right now but will definitely have to do some clearancing for a bigger bar.





Hey everyone, just wanted to let you guys know what I found when I installed the cradle and diff yesterday.

- had to grind down the area on the cradle for the racingbeat swaybar I'm running. (just like was mentioned before)
- I had a 1350 yoke put on my 8.8 when it was rebuilt, and even though it is smaller than the factory explorer flange, it still didn't clear the subframe. I just ground down/ dented in that area of the subframe and it now has about 1/2 inch of clearance. (is this enough?)

Even after all that it still only took me a few hours by myself to install. The front mount was super easy to locate and weld, and everything else lined up and bolted in like a charm. Very nice pieces. So as of now I'm just waiting on the halfshafts, and driveshaft measurements so I can order one. Im getting little-kid-like excited to drive this thing. Lol.
[/quote]
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 06, 2011, 01:50:26 PM
Since we've been communicating with testers mostly via email I thought I'd clarify the swaybar clearance change for those that don't know what's being referenced:

The Ronin cradle has two leave outs at the upper edges of rear mount plate sections intended to serve as swaybar clearance.  While this worked but was a tight fit on Anthony's car, Charlie found he needed just a touch more.  The lower lip on the leave outs needs to be chamfered by our testers planning to run a rear bar. 

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/ExplorerDiffRearMount_swaybarclearance.jpg)

This clearance will be added by Ronin on future kits produced.

Jerimiah, I sent you an email requesting clarification on the clearancing you did with the 1350 pinion yoke.  If you don't mind, I'd prefer to solve that offline.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on July 07, 2011, 01:24:31 PM
$$$ paid for my axles
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: TII_Arekusu on July 14, 2011, 08:05:07 PM
update?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on July 14, 2011, 08:15:19 PM
I finally paid for my axles a couple of days ago... so I was probably holding everything up. Sorry guyz  :chug:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fox4life on July 14, 2011, 09:09:11 PM
update?

I'll second that. Just havent heard anything in a little bit and there's a track event coming up in a few weeks I'd like to register for.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 15, 2011, 04:12:01 PM
Update:    

-All payments are in expect for one local who intends to give us cash.

-I talked with Charlie about the axles as-is and got all the data on these we've received to date (part numbers etc).

-I finally got my hands on the technical drawing and reviewed that for opportunities to improve these from a stress riser perspective.  It looked better than I'd thought from the pictures I'd seen to date.   I'm convinced these axles are just about optomized for what we can practically do while maintaining the required functions at each end.  As such we're replicating the first articles exactly.  Vendor was slow but appears to have delivered a quality product to us and that's what really counts.

-I just placed the batch order for halfshaft for all testers (plus a couple spare sets so we can have these in stock going forward.)

-The testers production run of axles will kick off at the beginning of next week.  All axles are being sent to Ronin in CA (I want to inspect them) and it's ESTIMATED that we'll have them in hand 3 weeks from now.  Add a bit if we need to ship these to you and that's the best timeline we have.

Jerimiah, I probably would not sign up for a track day as of yet.  One well running car isn't enough to prove that everyone's installs (and performance) will be flawless and I can't gurantee the timeline. 

Details on DS parts are forthcoming, I have Charlie's measurements but it's only apples to apples if you're using a Hinson mount kit and the smaller pinion flange (not a pinion yoke).  I need to order parts for myself as well.   
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fox4life on July 15, 2011, 09:06:19 PM
Cool, that's all I needed to hear. Looking forward to it.  :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on July 18, 2011, 10:06:21 PM
Update. I just got back from a nighttime, under the radar drive and am safely and comfortably back in my house with the garage door down. Couple of things, this thing has some serious legs now with 3:55 gears and no vibration at speeds well north of 125 :), and after living a long time without doing burnouts I am now finding more opportunities for "testing". It continues to work really well at striping asphalt and with no wheelhop at launch. One thing I noticed is a little bit of hop when I nailed it from a roll but really minimal. I have a little squeek in the rear that I did not have before and will investigate the source. I suspect it to be the rear swaybar rubbing which will be easy to spot and fix as well. I may end up needing to use some LSD additive as I notice a little chatter when turning. I am using Redline 75w140 and need to read up on whether they use any kind of additve as bottled. Small issues to deal with as expected.

I am curious to see how things go when harder bushings are utilized. At this early stage, I am sold on the Mazdaspeed rear bushings and stock Ford front bushing for what I am doing. I still have not shot any video and will not have the opportunity this weekend but I will do so asap.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on July 18, 2011, 10:11:20 PM
anybody that is installing this kit have a gopro camera?  that could be fun to get an under the car perspective during burnouts and launches...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 18, 2011, 10:45:55 PM
Update. I just got back from a nighttime, under the radar drive and am safely and comfortably back in my house with the garage door down. Couple of things, this thing has some serious legs now with 3:55 gears and no vibration at speeds well north of 125 :), and after living a long time without doing burnouts I am now finding more opportunities for "testing". It continues to work really well at striping asphalt and with no wheelhop at launch. One thing I noticed is a little bit of hop when I nailed it from a roll but really minimal. I have a little squeek in the rear that I did not have before and will investigate the source. I suspect it to be the rear swaybar rubbing which will be easy to spot and fix as well. I may end up needing to use some LSD additive as I notice a little chatter when turning. I am using Redline 75w140 and need to read up on whether they use any kind of additve as bottled. Small issues to deal with as expected.

I am curious to see how things go when harder bushings are utilized. At this early stage, I am sold on the Mazdaspeed rear bushings and stock Ford front bushing for what I am doing. I still have not shot any video and will not have the opportunity this weekend but I will do so asap.

Charlie,

Redline does not have any limited slip additive in the bottle, so get some in there! Royal purple does come with it already mixed in.

Depending on the surface, tire type, and temperature some "tire chatter" is fairly normal, even when solidly mounted. Is it actually hopping from a roll or is it just a chatter you can feel in the car that "blends" away with speed and/or traction?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on July 19, 2011, 02:43:41 PM
Thanks for the heads up on Redline not having the additive in it. I never had to add it on the stock diff but unless rebuilt and set up tight, they never chattered anyway. I am betting that you are right on tire chatter on a roll.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on July 19, 2011, 06:41:36 PM
Those of you who venture into this 8.8 swap, your going to love not worrying about hitting her hard! ;)

I dont have Joel's stuff, but the difference is insane! Having had the NA, then the T2 and now 8.8, its like going from Yugo, to Buick, to cadillac.

The best part is not having to fear the dreaded exploding diff issues associated with anything mazda related. It has no effect on normal daily driving, other then maybe a little bit of gear noise. When you want to "use your power" well, HAVE NO FEAR! :D :wave:

Since mine was done, I got 2500 miles of normal driving and many tests at the street drags in Lacrosse. My biggest issues is traction now lol. And good tires will cure that really quick! :P

GG JOEL! You got a good deal here! 8)

Keep striping the roads Charlie! :P
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: TII_Arekusu on July 27, 2011, 11:30:22 AM
 :lurk:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 01, 2011, 05:08:59 PM
Talked to our axle vendor.  Half shafts are out of machining and heat treat.  Last step is the black oxide surface finishing.  That means Ronin should have them in hand sometime the middle of next week.

I got all of the relative measurements from Charlie over the weekend (always a pleasure chatting with you fella!).  I'm putting my car up in the air tonight to take comparable measurements with Grannies kit.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on August 02, 2011, 08:58:15 PM
 8) 8) 8) :yay: :yay: :drive:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 03, 2011, 01:32:52 AM
For all the testers, I just emailed you the dimensional info and part recommendations for driveshafts.

We've had quite a few inquiries from folks in regards to purchasing this setup sooner rather than later.  We need to get final info on halfshaft boot cost and then we'll be posting up pricing for the production run.  We did order 4 extra sets of halfshafts so we can have parts ready to go quickly on the first few additional orders.

Regards all,
Joel Payne
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: TII_Arekusu on August 03, 2011, 12:17:26 PM
Looking forward to production.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 03, 2011, 07:51:07 PM
I just happened to look up the total American production numbers for 02-05 Ford Explorers vs. the production run of 03-04 Mustang Cobras.

Total Explorers --- 1,386,086
Total Cobras ----------19,140

I think we picked the right platform!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on August 09, 2011, 12:37:02 PM
Good to know.
Waiting in line too....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 09, 2011, 08:33:47 PM
Just an FYI: I have yet to received shipment confirmation on half shafts, so I can't guarantee when we'll get them.  I already have a follow up email in and I'll have to call them tomorrow.

I know some of you are getting anxious and/or thinking about events but this is mostly out of our control.  When I know more it'll get posted here immediately.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 10, 2011, 01:46:37 PM
Have confirmed status on halfshafts.  Surface treatment is done and parts are in inspection.  They hope to have them shipped to CA tomorrow.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fox4life on August 12, 2011, 02:32:38 PM
Good to hear!
 :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 12, 2011, 02:33:22 PM
We have a tracking number.  The first full round of halfshafts should be in CA on 8-17!  We'll check them out and get them distributed as quickly as we can.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: boostjunky on August 12, 2011, 09:21:39 PM
Watching this thread and waiting :) My stock diff just started its suicide process last week. It doesn't sound happy, may end it's life any moment now haha
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on August 13, 2011, 08:39:23 AM
We have a tracking number.  The first full round of halfshafts should be in CA on 8-17!  We'll check them out and get them distributed as quickly as we can.


I am so anxiuos for everyone else to get theirs together. I am happy to help with any questions. What did you find out on inner boot availability Joel?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 13, 2011, 11:43:57 AM
I am so anxiuos for everyone else to get theirs together. I am happy to help with any questions. What did you find out on inner boot availability Joel?

Rock Auto has a boot that is supposed to fit.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on August 13, 2011, 12:03:54 PM
I got mine from there. They are ok but I would like to have something more substantial.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 14, 2011, 09:15:39 PM
We've been looking at EMPI neoprene boots.  Several track hound buddies swear these boots are the best and I've been running them with good success on my own car for a while now.

The rub is that EMPI doesn't list a direct replacement boot for the inner Explorer rear (blows my mind given the number of vehicles sold but it's still true).  That left me doing a lot of reading to try to find a good compromise.  The Raybestos P/N at rock auto works (that's what Charlie used) but as mentioned I want to see if we can something higher end on the quality front.

I finally ended up going through EMPI's dimensional catalog and pulling a stack of numbers from various other applications that looked close.

The best options I've found thus far for the inner appears to be to EMPI 86-2240, 86-2103, or maybe 86-2326. One key variance between inner options is the total length of the boot.  Stock boot length appears to be about 4.5", and the above boots are basically 4.5, 5, and 5.6" long.

I left a message for charlie asking if he could verify the as-installed boot length for us as that might help me make a better recommendation (or a least know which of a couple to order for myself to try out.)

The t2 rx7 outer boot is EMPI 86-2127
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on August 24, 2011, 01:50:10 AM
any idea where we can source the boots ?  cant get them from my local auto parts suppliers and they carry EMPI 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on August 24, 2011, 12:50:04 PM
any idea where we can source the boots ?  cant get them from my local auto parts suppliers and they carry EMPI

out of all the places. i found them on ebay.

i was able to source**-**40 on ebay

the other one i found through my oem wholesale supplier worldpac.  however i think most of you will be sourcing ebay as ive tried  kohlweiss whoelsale and car quest  etc. with no lcuk
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 25, 2011, 01:21:31 AM
I just sent all the testers a bit more info on CV boots...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on August 26, 2011, 01:51:54 AM
do you have the lengths for the driveshaft using the Granny's kit?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 26, 2011, 11:43:25 AM
We have measurements based on comparisons between chassis for all kits (hinson, granny front/rear, and pez).  We gave those to all our testers.

However, we also gave our testers instructions how to take their own measurements and are having them send the measurements to us as I want the ability to validate the tolerances between chassis.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on September 01, 2011, 10:21:09 PM
Joel,

Aren't these done yet?  :D

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 02, 2011, 12:13:06 AM
All testers have kits so in that regards yes, they're done.  The bonus kits should start shipping next week.  Still have a couple left if anyone wants in last minute.  Email us for details at roninspeedworks@gmail.com

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 03, 2011, 05:07:25 PM
Damn boys, I'm getting lonely out here being the only one up and running. Anybody getting close? I swapped shocks today from AGX's to Bilstein and am really stoked so far. I did not want to go coilover on this car and am loving the control and frimness of the Bilsteins. The AGX's are really good and the adjustment is noticeable but so far Bilstein is the winner. And.......still no wheel hop!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 05, 2011, 02:21:20 PM
Charlie, Ronin sold a total of 7 test setups:

Yours is up.
1 other tester should be done but I haven't heard.
3 testers have a ways to go before their cars move.
1 car I haven't heard (Spoolin).
My car is about to get started and I'll be shooting for a fast turn around.

Several of the bonus kits are sold and will be shipping at the beginning of this week.  Install instructions will be a little draft-ish but it does compile all the info sent to testers in emails and lessoned learned to date.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on September 05, 2011, 03:56:33 PM
Do you guys know what the weight difference is between this and a t2 set up?  Just for future reference of course.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on September 05, 2011, 04:59:31 PM
I don't know the exact numbers but it's really close to being a wash, but I think it is a couple pounds lighter than the t2 setup.

But the extra strength, gear choice, and diff choice make it far superior to the t2. Plus if you ever need parts for it you can find them easily since there are tons of explorers out there.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 05, 2011, 06:03:18 PM
Damn boys, I'm getting lonely out here being the only one up and running. Anybody getting close? I swapped shocks today from AGX's to Bilstein and am really stoked so far. I did not want to go coilover on this car and am loving the control and frimness of the Bilsteins. The AGX's are really good and the adjustment is noticeable but so far Bilstein is the winner. And.......still no wheel hop!

I'm a month out or so. Joel gave me my halfshafts Saturday, and I have my truetrac already. I am waiting on the 8.8 install kit and my diff will be ready to go.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 05, 2011, 06:18:25 PM
Do you guys know what the weight difference is between this and a t2 set up?  Just for future reference of course.

I will weigh everything for sure in the next couple weeks unless joel beats me to it. My guesstimation is that the whole setup will be +/- 7 lbs. I don't have my halfshafts together yet and I think those will make the difference.

I think the Explorer diff and mounting hardware is roughly the same weight as the TurboII diff (could be wrong, but I will check for sure). The Explorer piece will be under 70 lbs once you remove the rear mounting ears (mine was 73 lbs with packaging for shipment)..I have heard that the TurboII diff is about 80 lbs, but I can't find an exact number at the moment.

The Explorer halfshafts weigh a lot more than the TII halfshafts, but we are throwing away the heaviest parts of the Explorer halfshaft.

My gut is that the "hybrid" halfshafts may be slightly heavier than the Turbo II shafts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on September 05, 2011, 10:47:38 PM
my "modified" 8.8 weighed 65 lbs and you're right I belive my T2 weights in @ 75 lbs.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DavidPHumes on September 06, 2011, 04:54:48 PM
I got my axles last week but decided to tear my car down so now I'm another 9 months out (with winter... le sigh).
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on September 07, 2011, 06:34:01 PM
Cant wait for the kit to get here
Getting my S**T together:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/ExplorerDIFF.jpg)
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DIFFTAG.jpg)
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 07, 2011, 06:54:52 PM
I'm going to pull my explorer diff apart this weekend and hack off the ears. Should be getting my Truetrac installed next week.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on September 08, 2011, 06:49:54 PM
I'm going to pull my explorer diff apart this weekend and hack off the ears. Should be getting my Truetrac installed next week.

I cant wait til all you guys get you stuff done lol. Your all gonna be like: YES!!!!!!!!!!! Thats the shit!!!!!!! :yay:

I was amazed at the difference in mine (not joels kit) when I finally started given it to her lol. Its definately night and day! I'm ready to start making some real power now lol.

The only real worry I have is the T2 outer CV's now. Without wheel hop, thats not really an issues anymore.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on September 08, 2011, 07:03:35 PM
I'm not sure if this was mentioned already, but do these custom axles only work with the TII outers? Or can they also be used with the N/A's and 929's also?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 08, 2011, 10:26:11 PM
t2 outers only
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 09, 2011, 03:19:46 PM
Hey Charlie,

I know we proved the NA outers are different.  Do you know with confidence that the 929's are different as well?   

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on September 09, 2011, 04:02:32 PM
t2 outers only

Damn, I was hoping to be able to sell the TII axles along with the diff if I go this route, and pick up a set of the less desirable "long" 929 axles or N/A's for the outers.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: FC3S Murray on September 09, 2011, 07:59:24 PM
Update. I just got back from a nighttime, under the radar drive and am safely and comfortably back in my house with the garage door down. Couple of things, this thing has some serious legs now with 3:55 gears and no vibration at speeds well north of 125 :), and after living a long time without doing burnouts I am now finding more opportunities for "testing". It continues to work really well at striping asphalt and with no wheelhop at launch. One thing I noticed is a little bit of hop when I nailed it from a roll but really minimal. I have a little squeek in the rear that I did not have before and will investigate the source. I suspect it to be the rear swaybar rubbing which will be easy to spot and fix as well. I may end up needing to use some LSD additive as I notice a little chatter when turning. I am using Redline 75w140 and need to read up on whether they use any kind of additve as bottled. Small issues to deal with as expected.

I am curious to see how things go when harder bushings are utilized. At this early stage, I am sold on the Mazdaspeed rear bushings and stock Ford front bushing for what I am doing. I still have not shot any video and will not have the opportunity this weekend but I will do so asap.

You need to post some video. I have been obssed with wonder what a t56 with 3.55 in the rear is like in our FC.
IF it is all that you say it is I will FOR sure be buying this swap kit.

Joel: you got a ball park price yet?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 09, 2011, 10:01:59 PM
You need to post some video. I have been obssed with wonder what a t56 with 3.55 in the rear is like in our FC.
IF it is all that you say it is I will FOR sure be buying this swap kit.

Joel: you got a ball park price yet?

It is all he says it is :) For a street car 3.55s will be fantastic in a car of this weight. You'll probably pull down close to 30 MPG on the highway too.

3.55 gears were an option in the Explorer/Mountaineer/Aviator. I dont know the option package that came with but they are out there.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: FC3S Murray on September 10, 2011, 11:17:27 AM
So if I was to compare my current 4.10 set up with my same power output(425rwhp) with 3.55 gearing, which set up would be faster? 1/4 mile times that is....(I know it is a question that has many factors that apply but I am just curious)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 10, 2011, 01:29:15 PM
Probably 4.10
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Simplex Effect on September 10, 2011, 05:23:38 PM
So if I was to compare my current 4.10 set up with my same power output(425rwhp) with 3.55 gearing, which set up would be faster? 1/4 mile times that is....(I know it is a question that has many factors that apply but I am just curious)

For street tires, I'll put my money on the 3.55

Even if it was faster with 4.10's on slicks, I'd stay with 3.55 for a better cruise.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: HTh3r0 on September 10, 2011, 10:04:15 PM
where are you guys sourcing your 02-05 rear diff from?!
I'm coming up empty handed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on September 10, 2011, 10:40:45 PM
I got mine off ebay for $ 425 shipped.
3.73 gears and posi.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 11, 2011, 02:02:56 AM
where are you guys sourcing your 02-05 rear diff from?!
I'm coming up empty handed.

Junkyard will be the most economical route.  They sold almost 1.4 million vehicles so just about any large junkyard is likely to have one.  You can also look for junkyards that specialize in SUVs or late model equipment.  I paid $122 for my diff with axles (albeit it was a half price weekend).

Of course there's always ebay or places that pull stuff for you but you will pay for the convenience.  You can also use google to search a particule website (add search term "site:whatever" IE "site:craigslist.org.")  The later turned up this one:

http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/pts/2559463618.html (http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/pts/2559463618.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 11, 2011, 03:33:01 AM
I found mine on Ebay for $200 shipped. It had 3.73s and an open diff.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7what on September 11, 2011, 04:09:19 AM
I got a stock 04 cobra diff off ebay for right around $400 shipped.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 11, 2011, 11:39:26 AM
t2 outers only

Sorry about jumping the gun with that reply. I don't know about the 929 outers and don't have one to check. Ray might know the answer to this one.

On locating a good used Exploder diff for good price, we have Pull-a-Part in the Atlanta area (2 locations) and they offer pretty generic pricing. Great modernized junkyard concept.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on September 11, 2011, 11:36:46 PM
Got a liitle done preparing for the 8.8 swap:
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/Earoff.jpg)
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/CoverMod.jpg)
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/CoverDone.jpg)
 
Ordered this STRANGE 1630 Yoke for the 8.8 Differential using 1350 UJoints:
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/str-u1630_w.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Rayminator on September 17, 2011, 04:00:33 PM
t2 outers only

Sorry about jumping the gun with that reply. I don't know about the 929 outers and don't have one to check. Ray might know the answer to this one.

On locating a good used Exploder diff for good price, we have Pull-a-Part in the Atlanta area (2 locations) and they offer pretty generic pricing. Great modernized junkyard concept.

929 outers are usable, the ones we swapped were 89-91( maybe 88 also).....either side, same same.
They do look slightly different from the T-II, internals were interchanged with no issues.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 19, 2011, 01:12:40 PM
Thanks Ray,

I double checked the EMPI catalog and the 929 calls for the same outer CV boot we're using so it looks like that would be a decent option.  That said, I strongly recommend against using any rebuilt CV as your outers. 

For the "precision" machining involved with most rebuilt axles see the following and jump to about 2:10.  This is a major player in the rebuild market BTW.

cv joint (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6u1cZWiVAM#)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on September 20, 2011, 12:40:27 PM
Thanks Ray,

I double checked the EMPI catalog and the 929 calls for the same outer CV boot we're using so it looks like that would be a decent option.  That said, I strongly recommend against using any rebuilt CV as your outers. 

For the "precision" machining involved with most rebuilt axles see the following and jump to about 2:10.  This is a major player in the rebuild market BTW.

cv joint (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6u1cZWiVAM#)

I feel like I just watched a secret video from inside a slaughter house. It's no wonder people complain of "cluncking" in the driveline!

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 20, 2011, 08:28:40 PM
So thats what REM polishing looks like.....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on September 20, 2011, 08:30:30 PM
So thats what REM polishing looks like.....

Nah, thats probably more like Ron polishing... or maybe Joe?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on September 21, 2011, 09:43:50 PM
So thats what REM polishing looks like.....

Nah, thats probably more like Ron polishing... or maybe Joe?

The video clearly states that it is the famous Tommy polishing method.  :wave:

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on September 24, 2011, 07:31:50 AM
t2 outers only

Sorry about jumping the gun with that reply. I don't know about the 929 outers and don't have one to check. Ray might know the answer to this one.

On locating a good used Exploder diff for good price, we have Pull-a-Part in the Atlanta area (2 locations) and they offer pretty generic pricing. Great modernized junkyard concept.

929 outers are usable, the ones we swapped were 89-91( maybe 88 also).....either side, same same.
They do look slightly different from the T-II, internals were interchanged with no issues.

Ray is correct. Mine has 929 outer CV's. I cracked a cage on mine a while ago and swapped it with one from a T2 CV. Perfect match. The races are the same as well as the ball bearings. The only difference is the shape of the cup itself on the outside. mine has ABS rings but I had no issues with clearances on the hubs or the spindle areas at all. The hub splines are the same as well as the nut thread pitch. ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 24, 2011, 07:46:13 AM
Update-I installed my Tick Preformance, stage 3, F Body t56 this week and love the gearing matched to the 3.55 final drive. I also fitted the MGW shifter from the old FD race car and am happy with it too. Look forward to SNS 11 to show it all off. Driving it to the Atlanta Chili Cookoff today.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on September 24, 2011, 07:51:09 AM
Quote
Ray is correct. Mine has 929 outer CV's. I cracked a cage on mine a while ago and swapped it with one from a T2 CV. Perfect match. The races are the same as well as the ball bearings. The only difference is the shape of the cup itself on the outside. mine has ABS rings but I had no issues with clearances on the hubs or the spindle areas at all. The hub splines are the same as well as the nut thread pitch. (http://www.norotors.com/Smileys/classic/gr_wink.gif)

Well, that is great information, because TII halfshats are becoming so scarce.  Do you happen to know if only the 929 years cited are the compatible ones? (89-91)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on September 24, 2011, 11:32:08 AM
Quote
Ray is correct. Mine has 929 outer CV's. I cracked a cage on mine a while ago and swapped it with one from a T2 CV. Perfect match. The races are the same as well as the ball bearings. The only difference is the shape of the cup itself on the outside. mine has ABS rings but I had no issues with clearances on the hubs or the spindle areas at all. The hub splines are the same as well as the nut thread pitch. (http://www.norotors.com/Smileys/classic/gr_wink.gif)

Well, that is great information, because TII halfshats are becoming so scarce.  Do you happen to know if only the 929 years cited are the compatible ones? (89-91)

that I cant answer, but I'd bet they are. I doubt they changed much in design forthe later models. 929 are just as hard to find as T2's. most of this stuff went to the scrap heep the last few years. Not much out there. it would be nice to find another source for these CV's tho. GL! ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on September 24, 2011, 12:16:25 PM
I just saw a '93 929 in a junkyard a couple weeks ago that still had its axles.  I didn't grab them though and went back later to find the whole car was gone.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on September 24, 2011, 12:32:17 PM
I just saw a '93 929 in a junkyard a couple weeks ago that still had its axles.  I didn't grab them though and went back later to find the whole car was gone.

I am pretty sure that the 93 929s have similar axles to FDs, not FCs.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 27, 2011, 08:29:21 PM
Hey fellow testers, I came across an issue with my car that I thought I would investigate a liitle bit and have come up with some new info that will hopefully be of good use to all of you. When I swapped my trans last week I was curious about how much endplay (back and forth movement) I should have on my driveshaft. What I mean is how much should the front slip yoke move back/forth when the rear flange is unbolted from the diff. I have felt some oddball vibrations before when the driveshaft was slightly too long and having it shortened fixed the problem. I consulted my local driveshaft shop (they built my aluminum shaft) and  was told 1" is the preferred clearance. This was the same measurement I got from Precision Shaft Technologies when I asked them the question as I gave the dimensions to have a carbon fiber shaft made.

Bottom line, my current clearance is only 3/8" and if I really hammer the car I feel a rumble come up through the center of the car that feels like something is contacting like exhaust or something like that. The driveshaft guys ask for certain dimensions when you order a custom shaft and build off of those measurements. For whatever reason the shaft fits to the car fine on installation but I am betting that under hard load the slip yoke bottoms on the output shaft of the trans causing a rumble/resonance. I'll have the aluminum shaft back tomorrow and will install and test it. I think I will have the carbon shaft in for SNS11 .
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on September 27, 2011, 11:59:14 PM
what happen to pics of the front mount welding ?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on September 28, 2011, 12:07:15 AM
Charlie, Ronin sold a total of 7 test setups:

Yours is up.
1 other tester should be done but I haven't heard.
3 testers have a ways to go before their cars move.
1 car I haven't heard (Spoolin).
My car is about to get started and I'll be shooting for a fast turn around.

Several of the bonus kits are sold and will be shipping at the beginning of this week.  Install instructions will be a little draft-ish but it does compile all the info sent to testers in emails and lessoned learned to date.


my car  got dropped off with a friends shop to have the rear end installed. should have an update by next week.  i did have a DS made as per instructions  on the data sheet provided.  will have driveshaft modified depending on how it works on my car .
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 28, 2011, 12:22:46 PM
what happen to pics of the front mount welding ?

Please take some for us.  I don't have any as I haven't done my own car yet.  You want to tack weld the front mount with everything in a test assembly state under the car.  Pull it down and weld the entire exposed perimeter (bottom surface will be a fillet weld, top and sides are fillet and butt welds depending on how it lands).
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 28, 2011, 12:29:16 PM
somebody tell me how to get my pictures to fit on this damn site and I will. For whatever reason, every time I try to post pics, they are too big. Make it simple for me, I am not as well versed in computer stuff as you guys that had one in your crib just after birth! I normally just download off of my phone or camera and had no issues on the old site.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on September 28, 2011, 12:54:26 PM
You can use the "gallery" it will resize them for you automatically.   There is a sticky in the lounge on how to use the Gallery if you have any questions on it.  :)

Or, you can email them to me at:  digitalsolo@ls1fc.com and I will resize/post them for you.  :)

I have to limit the sizing on uploaded pics to a) keep GoDaddy happy and b) help keep security proper.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 28, 2011, 02:21:04 PM
Thanks Blake! Not complaining, just ignorant! Ill check the lounge and start posting!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 28, 2011, 05:16:40 PM
I always swore by the Microsoft XP powertoy picture resizer.
http://download.cnet.com/Image-Resizer-Powertoy-for-Windows-XP/3000-18487_4-10905400.html (http://download.cnet.com/Image-Resizer-Powertoy-for-Windows-XP/3000-18487_4-10905400.html)

They don't support it for Win7 but I found a clone that works well.
http://imageresizer.codeplex.com/releases/view/30247 (http://imageresizer.codeplex.com/releases/view/30247)

Select whatever photos you want (multiple files can be done at once) right click and select the size you want, probably "medium" for here.  Also great for email.  Fast and simple.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on September 28, 2011, 06:44:54 PM
What is the bore diameter spec on the TII differential housing for the rubber mounts?
I an starting tha assembly of my 8.8 and was not able to press the new Mazdatrix "race" mounts in there.
On the RONIN cradle one of them measures 2.579" and the other one 2.590"  The bushing did not fit in the larger one.
The gap on the metal shell closed completely and the bushing does not fit in the bore
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on September 28, 2011, 07:06:25 PM
I believe the bore on the factory is 2.595(Have to double check the measurement) I think which all the sleeves were machined to. I didn't have any issues pressing in my bushing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on September 28, 2011, 11:29:09 PM
What is the bore diameter spec on the TII differential housing for the rubber mounts?
I an starting tha assembly of my 8.8 and was not able to press the new Mazdatrix "race" mounts in there.
On the RONIN cradle one of them measures 2.579" and the other one 2.590"  The bushing did not fit in the larger one.
The gap on the metal shell closed completely and the bushing does not fit in the bore

Can't give the measurements on stock setup but can tell you the race mounts are identical in dimension to stock bushings and they are what I am running. The only difference is higher durometer rubber. They were a very tight fit in mine but not impossible. I have a bunch of different tools for my press so it makes it easier.

I did not powdercoat my diff mount because I did not want to tighten the bore that the bushing fits in.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 29, 2011, 09:41:00 AM
What is the bore diameter spec on the TII differential housing for the rubber mounts?
I an starting tha assembly of my 8.8 and was not able to press the new Mazdatrix "race" mounts in there.
On the RONIN cradle one of them measures 2.579" and the other one 2.590"  The bushing did not fit in the larger one.
The gap on the metal shell closed completely and the bushing does not fit in the bore

Please bring any issues you're having to Ronin directly before you post them online.  Not a huge deal but we generally perfer to be the first to know rather than let other folks speculate.

Factory bores are 2.585".  We machine the mount sleeves to that, but things can move around a bit when welding so in that regard yours sounds correct.  You may need a press to install factory bushings, regardless of whether there's stock or "comp".  When I last did this on a t2 rear the gap between metal sides closed to zero just like you mentioned.  If you really think it's just too tight you can always shave one side of the metal to metal gap prior to pressing (send us a picture if you do).  A thin layer of grease on the outside surface of the mount can help as well.

As Charlie mentioned, if you powdercoat it'd be a good idea to mask the bores.   We send these out bare (let's users choose paint scheme, plus folks have to weld on the front anyways so we can't coat/paint that).  I'll add a little commentary to the install document to address this topic.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on September 29, 2011, 09:52:53 AM
I will send you a couple of pictures
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 05, 2011, 04:41:01 PM
FYI:  We have one full diff kit left in stock and ready to go.  Technically I suppose we have two kits, but only if you ask nice enough and I sell the one I have set aside for myself. 

Shoot us an email at roninspeedworks@gmail.com if you'd like details.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on October 06, 2011, 07:28:50 AM
My Kit arrived yesterday! :) :)
I have already sent my axles off to Hudson machine shop to have them put together.
& getting my posi installed today . (my diff was a open 3.55 :( ) .
Ordered my posi unit from Americanmuscle.com (Ford Racing Traction-Lok # 4204-F318C)  and it was only 229.00  to the Door  :o !! no shipping or Handling charges!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on October 06, 2011, 09:55:47 AM
So are there any pictures of the whole assembly completely installed in a vehicle?

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on October 06, 2011, 09:25:03 PM
PM sent.

FYI:  We have one full diff kit left in stock and ready to go.  Technically I suppose we have two kits, but only if you ask nice enough and I sell the one I have set aside for myself. 

Shoot us an email at roninspeedworks@gmail.com if you'd like details.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on October 07, 2011, 05:08:02 PM
(http://www.solarnavigator.net/films_movies_actors/cartoons/cartoon_images/finding_nemo_seagulls_sydney_harbour.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 383mazda on October 08, 2011, 01:54:58 PM
Hey Joel,

When do you think you'll have these up on your website for sale?  I'd like this to be a winter / early spring project...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 10, 2011, 12:54:40 PM
There's basically two things left prior to wide release:

-I'd like feedback in from a few more testers (hint hint fellas). 

-I want to finish my own install so I can have a few more pictures for the documentation we provide.   I might be able to get these from others but it's a pain to document each and every step.

Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 10, 2011, 05:47:59 PM
Well I just got my car back from Anthony... I'm nearly ready to install the kit.

Just need to swap diffs, and dissassemble my explorer halfshafts and I will be ready.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on October 10, 2011, 07:36:27 PM
I got my lsd, so i just need to order my bearings and put the diff together then, I can get my 8.8 installed as well.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 10, 2011, 08:39:53 PM
I just finished the rebuild of my 8.8 and POSI with the Cobra Kit and will be swapping differentials soon.
 
What are you guys doing with the breather hole in the cover? 
Plug it and drill a small (1/16" ) hole thru the plug?
Use a small pneumatic filter/silencer?
Barbed connector and hose?
Other Suggestions?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 10, 2011, 09:33:19 PM
The cradle has space to run the factory barb and hose, however that may be a bit harder to come by for folks not pulling their own.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 10, 2011, 09:45:13 PM
Im going to knock out what is left of my factory barb and tap the cover for pipe thread to run a brass nipple, probably 90 degree.  You could run a loop, aim it back down, and attach it to something so if it vents lube it wont get on anything, or run it to an expansion tank with a vent.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on October 10, 2011, 10:33:47 PM
my diff came with a plastic sleeve w/ hose a on it. I plan to junk yard fine a "vent " to fit the hose .
BTW,  Hudson machine shop wouldn't put my axles together  :'( says that they can get the T2 end off of the axle without destrying the race...I got to find another shop that's more familiar with disassmbling Mazda axles :(
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 11, 2011, 08:16:14 PM
Getting Closer:
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00122-20111011-1756.jpg)
 
Plugged the ABS sensor hole and machined the top of the housing for clearance:
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00120-20111011-1756.jpg)
 
Opted for this simple solution for the case vent:
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00117-20111011-1755.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 12, 2011, 01:45:09 AM
Ricardo,

Do you have a part number for that vent?  I like it though I'm guessing it did take one extra step to drill and tap the hole.  For what it's worth, you also did one of the nicest jobs I've seen yet on the diff cover trimming.  It's fun seeing our goods out there getting built up.  Did you decide to go with 1310 or 1350 series yokes and u-joints?

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on October 12, 2011, 08:05:08 PM
Cast aluminum case, cant you guys run a deflector sheild of some in the diff cover to prevent the build up of fluid in the vent? I did it with my STEEL diff cover? It take some thought, but comon guys, your engineers!  :yay: :bacon: :bacon: :bacon: :bacon:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Infidel on October 12, 2011, 08:21:15 PM
that looks amazing, you guys had better have this next spring/summer i'm all tapped out right now.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 13, 2011, 12:29:40 AM
Thanks guys I just can't wait to have this 8.8 on my FC
 
I dont have a part number for that particular vent I used.  I just grabbed it from an old solenoid valve at work, but here is a link for a similar breather vent sold by GRAINGER.  I also found a lot of them on ebay under  "Pneumatic Air breather Vent Silencer"
 
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ARROW-Breather-Vent-1EJT5?cm_mmc=GoogleBase-_-Pneumatics-_-Pneumatic%20System%20Components-_-1EJT5&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=1EJT5 (http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/ARROW-Breather-Vent-1EJT5?cm_mmc=GoogleBase-_-Pneumatics-_-Pneumatic%20System%20Components-_-1EJT5&ci_src=17588969&ci_sku=1EJT5)
 
I turned the threads down and then machined a small aluminum bushing to fit the hole on the cover.  It is a press fit for my cover.  If you are going to drill and tap you should choose a 1/4"NPT breather.
 
The case cover has a baffle and deflector on the inner side.
 
The Yoke I used is the STRANGE for 1350 U joints.
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 13, 2011, 10:39:38 AM
Ricardo,

Is the yoke you purchased a U1630?

http://www.jegs.com/i/Strange-Engineering/873/U1630/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Strange-Engineering/873/U1630/10002/-1)

Also did the U bolts that hold the joint come with it?


To the group,

These u joint girdles seem pretty sweet, but are they overkill for a 500 HP car that wont be drag raced?

(http://www.jegs.com/images/photos/500/555/555-60600.jpg)

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS-Performance-Products/555/60600/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS-Performance-Products/555/60600/10002/-1)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 13, 2011, 07:59:01 PM
Quote
Is the yoke you purchased a U1630?

http://www.jegs.com/i/Strange-Engineering/873/U1630/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Strange-Engineering/873/U1630/10002/-1)

Also did the U bolts that hold the joint come with it?


Yes, thats the one.
The U bolts were not included with the yoke. I got the STRANGE U-1610 U bolt kit
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 383mazda on October 13, 2011, 11:35:35 PM
There's basically two things left prior to wide release:

-I'd like feedback in from a few more testers (hint hint fellas). 

-I want to finish my own install so I can have a few more pictures for the documentation we provide.   I might be able to get these from others but it's a pain to document each and every step.

Joel

Sounds good - I just need an ordering option for dummies, as in, "I plan on making XXX hp, so I'll need these options..."

Can't wait till the big release!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on October 16, 2011, 01:41:30 PM
The pictures look great.

Don't forget to use a two-piece slip yoke in the front. That will make life much easier when removing and installing the driveshaft.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on October 16, 2011, 07:57:18 PM
The pictures look great.

Don't forget to use a two-piece slip yoke in the front. That will make life much easier when removing and installing the driveshaft.

Andrew

That was the direction I took Andrew. I started with an aluminum shaft for testing but have a carbon shaft on the way to me this week. Wish you could have made it SNS 2011 last weekend. Finally met Berg in person and had a great time.

Charlie
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 17, 2011, 12:35:05 AM
PMed you about your driveshaft Charlie.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 19, 2011, 06:48:40 PM
A question for the forum:

To date we've been shipping all diff kits bare.  We can't coat the front cradle because it needs to be welded in.  That said, I'm wondering if we should start powder coating the rear cradle to save folks some effort in painting or coating themselves.  We did one and it came out truly amazing.

That said, it's a bit of a complex part to coat and we can only throw one in our oven at at time so it'd likely have to come with a $50 up charge.  Is that worth it or are most folks happy enough to break out the rattle can (and pick the color of their choice instead of just black)?

Thoughts?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on October 19, 2011, 07:03:00 PM
Personally, if (when) I get one... it will be powdercoated.  Who does it is semi open to change.  The part that needs welded.... does it get welded to the rear subframe?  If so, people that powdercoat the cradle might also want to get the subframe powdercoated as well.  From my experience money can be saved by having multiple items coated at once.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on October 19, 2011, 08:09:45 PM
Being the first tester and not knowing if any revisions would need to be made,  I rattle canned mine. My original subframe was powder coated and I have plenty of spares that are not so I saved the powdercoated unit and cleaned up one of the spares to weld the Ronin platform to. As much as I love powdercoating, I don't think I will get my cradle done if/when i ever need to take it out of the car. I initially thought it would look really cool if it were coated but it is so stealthy under the car that it really doesn't show.

One thing that I have found to work really well for deep cleaning chassis parts as well as plastic and rubber parts on RX7's is oven cleaner. I buy the cheapest oven cleaner I can get from the dollar store, spray everything down, let it eat for a few minutes and pressure wash. Subframes, cv boots on axles, plastic undertrays, etc. come out looking factory new without etching. I don't use oven cleaner on aluminum parts but I have tried it on unimportant stuff and really not had any bad results. Generally I clean aluminum with mild degreaser and alot of elbow grease.

By the way, the Ronin Explorer rearend setup is outstanding! You guys need to get your priorities in order and start neglecting your family and job so you can experience what all the cool kids are doing :drive:


Someone was asking for pics of front platform welded. Here you go.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on October 20, 2011, 07:18:29 AM

By the way, the Ronin Explorer rearend setup is outstanding! You guys need to get your priorities in order and start neglecting your family and job so you can experience what all the cool kids are doing :drive:


Hey I have been trying to sell all the extra stuff in the garage to pay for all the cool Ronin parts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 20, 2011, 12:05:36 PM
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/317791_10150330221376452_504046451_8205486_1035193617_n.jpg)


(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/311065_10150330220596452_504046451_8205482_769925260_n.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 20, 2011, 12:15:49 PM
I'll have mine going next week sometime. Have to get my 8.8 rebuilt
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on October 20, 2011, 02:18:29 PM
I would sell the parts bare and let the end users decide what coatings to use. This will also simplify shipping and avoid any damage during shipping.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 21, 2011, 12:02:49 AM
Quote
Ray is correct. Mine has 929 outer CV's. I cracked a cage on mine a while ago and swapped it with one from a T2 CV. Perfect match. The races are the same as well as the ball bearings. The only difference is the shape of the cup itself on the outside. mine has ABS rings but I had no issues with clearances on the hubs or the spindle areas at all. The hub splines are the same as well as the nut thread pitch. (http://www.norotors.com/Smileys/classic/gr_wink.gif)

Well, that is great information, because TII halfshats are becoming so scarce.  Do you happen to know if only the 929 years cited are the compatible ones? (89-91)

that I cant answer, but I'd bet they are. I doubt they changed much in design forthe later models. 929 are just as hard to find as T2's. most of this stuff went to the scrap heep the last few years. Not much out there. it would be nice to find another source for these CV's tho. GL! ;)

Upon checking dimensions of new CV Joint kits at a parts supplier found that these Mazda 626 match the spline count of the TII outers: 26 and 28.  The thread pitch on the outer end is different and the splined shaft is about 5 mm shorter but the kit is supplied with a new nut that includes a formed washer. This elliminates the need to use the thick 5mm washer supplied with the TII axle sahfts:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00125-20111018-1735.jpg)
 
The oil seal diameter stub is also a tad smaller:  56MM VRS 58MM on the TII.
The National oil seal No 710393 seems to fill this gap: 72x 56 x 8.
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 21, 2011, 12:11:04 AM
I dont have a TII CV joint disassembled for comparison yet, but here is a picture of the 626 CV Joint (left) side by side with a FC NA CV joint (right). 
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/NA-626CVJoint.jpg)
 
I plan to try them out in my swap.  These in particular are made in Germany.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 21, 2011, 11:17:10 AM
Ricardo,

Please keep us posted.  I'm VERY interested in your CV findings as that would remove one of the harder steps (teardown of the T2 axles).  Also users would then be able to sell their T2 axles whole, thereby recouping a large percentage of the cost of the new parts.

Can you shoot me a PM with details on where you found these plus year and model details?  I would want to enquire whether batch pricing was available.  From EMPI's CV boot catalog it appears there are a variety of CV's in use on the 626's.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/Empi_626.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 21, 2011, 11:49:35 AM
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/321220_10150332236906452_504046451_8216130_849553987_n.jpg)


(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s720x720/299613_10150332237236452_504046451_8216131_1294782656_n.jpg)

(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/307136_10150332237571452_504046451_8216133_743600572_n.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 21, 2011, 11:58:15 AM
Ricardo, let me know where you got those from and the cost.

I was scouring the GKN catalog this morning and it is horrible to look for something by make an model. I can only get a result when I put in a part number, using the number off of the box in your picture.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on October 21, 2011, 03:42:21 PM
I dont have a TII CV joint disassembled for comparison yet, but here is a picture of the 626 CV Joint (left) side by side with a FC NA CV joint (right). 
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/NA-626CVJoint.jpg)
 
I plan to try them out in my swap.  These in particular are made in Germany.

The 626 CVs look larger than the TIIs, which is good, but there may be an issue with then not fitting inside the rear control arms.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 21, 2011, 04:19:23 PM
Hybrid axle shafts assembled with new outer CV Joints:
The OD of these  88-92 Turbo 626 CV joint is the same as the FC TII CV Joint.
Dont know if the turbo version of the 626 was brought into the US
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/HybridAxleshafts.jpg)
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on October 21, 2011, 04:49:59 PM
Hybrid axle shafts assembled with new outer CV Joints:
The OD of these  88-92 Turbo 626 CV joint is the same as the FC TII CV Joint.
Dont know if the turbo version of the 626 was brought into the US
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/HybridAxleshafts.jpg)

Nice! I guess it was just the angle of the picture that made the 626 CV look bigger. So is the seal diameter the only difference between these and the TII CVs?

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 21, 2011, 05:12:12 PM
 
Quote
So is the seal diameter the only difference between these and the TII CVs?

The outer splined shaft is a tad shorter but it does not matter.  You leave out the 5mm thick washer used by the TII setup.  The nut suplied with the kit has a washer formed on one end.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 21, 2011, 05:35:13 PM
will be picking up my FC from  my buddys shop tonight.  although i would /could do this swap myself i simply did not have the time to do it.  they did the welding etc and just dropped it off with another friends shop to be aligned.   This weekend i will be testing out at buttonwillow raceway  and post a review.

 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 21, 2011, 10:47:32 PM
ill write up a review later.   so far so good. i have solid diff mounts and solid subframe mounts. i do have the stock explorer rubber mount.

its nice to not have to keep shifting all the darn time.   there is some wheel hop still depending how you launch. im runnin 265/40/17 direzza starspecs in the rear with 40 psi cold  because i plan to track it this weekend and im going to let air out instead of having to fill it in.

i tried a 3600 rpm launch and it hopped pretty bad and popped out of gear.    No odd rattles the 1st tester had with the DS, the advertised DS length for hinson/ ronin rear end worked out for me.  If anything I will have more input as I have  more seat time.
  a mild 2900 rpm launch it was fine.   shifting 1-2 2-3 feels good  and tracks straight with minimal hop.  Im sure if my tire pressure was much lower my car would be happier. but its 10 times less violent hop as before.


http://youtu.be/WXWHG5jwK1A (http://youtu.be/WXWHG5jwK1A)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 21, 2011, 10:56:48 PM
Awesome! glad you got it going.


Start at like 32 PSI cold and you will be much better off. I usually start off at 29-30 cold unless it is below 60 degrees.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 21, 2011, 11:04:25 PM
Hybrid axle shafts assembled with new outer CV Joints:
The OD of these  88-92 Turbo 626 CV joint is the same as the FC TII CV Joint.
Dont know if the turbo version of the 626 was brought into the US
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/HybridAxleshafts.jpg)

Those look great Ricardo! Shoot me the ebay link to these if you can. I've been looking through Ebay and I'm on my 2nd drink and losing intrest  :yay:

I was kinda feeling bad about destroying a perfectly good set of TII axles.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: willcoop on October 22, 2011, 12:19:15 AM
Has anyone looked into if Ford probe half shafts will work? I found a cv that looks similar to the T2 cv and this is the data for it.

APPLICABLE MODEL:
MAZDA FORD Probe 3.0L A/T V6
TURBO 626 MX6 88-92 2.2L A/T M/T
W/ABS MX6GDEP GDES GDEA
GDEP 87-91 A/T MX6GDEP GDES GDEA
GDEP 87-91 M/T
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 22, 2011, 12:44:05 AM
Quote
Those look great Ricardo! Shoot me the ebay link to these if you can. I've been looking through Ebay and I'm on my 2nd drink and losing intrest  (http://www.norotors.com/Smileys/classic/awesome.gif)

Ashley:
Sorry about the info I posted before.  I double checked the ebay listed CV joints and the spline count does not match the required 26/28 for our application.
 
Willcoop:
the ones you listed should be OK. It would be better if you can check the spline count.  The ones I bought were listed for 626-MX6 Turbo 88-90.
 
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on October 22, 2011, 11:23:05 AM
ill write up a review later.   so far so good. i have solid diff mounts and solid subframe mounts. i do have the stock explorer rubber mount.

its nice to not have to keep shifting all the darn time.   there is some wheel hop still depending how you launch. im runnin 265/40/17 direzza starspecs in the rear with 40 psi cold  because i plan to track it this weekend and im going to let air out instead of having to fill it in.

i tried a 3600 rpm launch and it hopped pretty bad and popped out of gear.    No odd rattles the 1st tester had with the DS, the advertised DS length for hinson/ ronin rear end worked out for me.  If anything I will have more input as I have  more seat time.
  a mild 2900 rpm launch it was fine.   shifting 1-2 2-3 feels good  and tracks straight with minimal hop.  Im sure if my tire pressure was much lower my car would be happier. but its 10 times less violent hop as before.


http://youtu.be/WXWHG5jwK1A (http://youtu.be/WXWHG5jwK1A)



Glad to hear you are up and running. Can't wait to hear more feedback as you spend more time in the car.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 22, 2011, 07:10:28 PM
Has anyone looked into if Ford probe half shafts will work? I found a cv that looks similar to the T2 cv and this is the data for it.

APPLICABLE MODEL:
MAZDA FORD Probe 3.0L A/T V6
TURBO 626 MX6 88-92 2.2L A/T M/T
W/ABS MX6GDEP GDES GDEA
GDEP 87-91 A/T MX6GDEP GDES GDEA
GDEP 87-91 M/T

I have not verified anything with a part number yet, but I did see talk of Probe CVs being the "same"
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 22, 2011, 07:29:28 PM
In other news, my diff is in, but I will need to pull it back out to ream the holes in the delrin diff mounts a bit. The pinion side needs to come up a couple degrees order to weld the front mount in place, and the diff does not move at all, even when it is just sitting on the mounting studs.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_01761.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 22, 2011, 08:59:26 PM
you guys shoudl keep in mind.  the driveshaft should be installed @ the same time as the cradle .   it wont go in  after the subframe etcc's been installed
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 22, 2011, 09:45:17 PM
you guys shoudl keep in mind.  the driveshaft should be installed @ the same time as the cradle .   it wont go in  after the subframe etcc's been installed

What yoke and U joints did you use at the tranny and differential end?
You should be able to pull it out with a 2 piece transmissin yoke. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 23, 2011, 02:10:02 AM
you guys shoudl keep in mind.  the driveshaft should be installed @ the same time as the cradle .   it wont go in  after the subframe etcc's been installed

What yoke and U joints did you use at the tranny and differential end?
You should be able to pull it out with a 2 piece transmissin yoke.
''


1310 u joints with  2 piece transmission.  i didnt supervise the  install but my buddy told me it wouldn't go in.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on October 23, 2011, 09:39:26 AM
you guys shoudl keep in mind.  the driveshaft should be installed @ the same time as the cradle .   it wont go in  after the subframe etcc's been installed

What yoke and U joints did you use at the tranny and differential end?
You should be able to pull it out with a 2 piece transmissin yoke.

What he ^ said. I swapped in my carbon fiber shaft on Friday night in less than 30 minutes start to finish. 2 piece slipyoke makes it possible.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on October 23, 2011, 08:22:31 PM
you guys shoudl keep in mind.  the driveshaft should be installed @ the same time as the cradle .   it wont go in  after the subframe etcc's been installed

What yoke and U joints did you use at the tranny and differential end?
You should be able to pull it out with a 2 piece transmissin yoke.


Guess I cant understand why a guy needs a 2 peice yoke to get the thing together/apart when it only takes a few (30 minutes) to drop the entire subframe? Is it just me? Or am I on the fringe here?  ::)

IMHO its easy to drop the sub frame. Its more a PITA to try to work around dropping the sub frame. 8)

The plus is you dont have as many parts therefore less likely to vibrate at high rpm's.  ;)

But I'm just a back yard guy so! :P

What he ^ said. I swapped in my carbon fiber shaft on Friday night in less than 30 minutes start to finish. 2 piece slipyoke makes it possible.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on October 23, 2011, 10:54:09 PM
Guess I cant understand why a guy needs a 2 peice yoke to get the thing together/apart when it only takes a few (30 minutes) to drop the entire subframe? Is it just me? Or am I on the fringe here?  ::)

IMHO its easy to drop the sub frame. Its more a PITA to try to work around dropping the sub frame. 8)

The plus is you dont have as many parts therefore less likely to vibrate at high rpm's.  ;)

But I'm just a back yard guy so! :P

How could it possibly be easier to drop the subframe, than to NOT drop the subframe?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on October 24, 2011, 09:12:12 AM
Yup, dropping the subframe sounds like a whole lot of "I'd rather be doing something else". Depending on exhaust configuration, the shaft should slide to the back, bolt to the pinion flange, slide into the front yoke and go. No vibration added by 2 piece yoke.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on October 24, 2011, 09:20:19 AM
FWIW, I have a Dana rear, which also requires dropping the subframe to pull the driveshaft, and I'm definitely planning on a 2 piece yoke assuming I keep this setup and don't go to a solid axle.    I only have to drop the cradle about 3" to get clearance and it's still a PITA compared to just pulling 4 bolts.  ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 24, 2011, 12:26:05 PM
well quite possibly  it was just installer " noob" on the ronin setup  issues with the DS.


took it out this weekend to buttonwillow and had a great time , rear end worked flawlessly, i drove there and back from the bay area ( 200 miles) with no problems, going 85-90 in 6th gear cruising 2K rpm is great !


The rear end did puke some fluid out the vent cover and i do have a vent hose routed as far up as it could go.  other than that its fine.




<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/JIgGEKjuBPw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>




I may need to invest in some ronin front brakes  as i baked the pads after the 1st session, at the end of the 2nd session i believe i glazed the pad over, 3rd session i only got two laps in and went in to bleed the brakes, 4th session i got 4 laps in before i had to pull in again.   
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on October 24, 2011, 03:05:57 PM
Has anyone looked into if Ford probe half shafts will work? I found a cv that looks similar to the T2 cv and this is the data for it.

APPLICABLE MODEL:
MAZDA FORD Probe 3.0L A/T V6
TURBO 626 MX6 88-92 2.2L A/T M/T
W/ABS MX6GDEP GDES GDEA
GDEP 87-91 A/T MX6GDEP GDES GDEA
GDEP 87-91 M/T

That should be the same part as posted earlier. The Probe was based on the 626/MX-6 platform.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 25, 2011, 06:23:03 PM
FYI: we just received our second batch of axles and cut a bunch more piece parts for kits so we have these available.  We're still calling these "early production" kits as we're incorporating feedback as it comes in.  Among other things I need to do a little more research to see if a new outboard CV can be sourced in mass as that's been one of the more exciting developements coming from users to date.   Thank you Ricardo!

I'm updating the install insturctions with all lessons learned to date and will be compiling an email for those who have purchased a kit thus far.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on October 25, 2011, 06:31:21 PM
I'm sure its lost in the 18 pages of this thread somewhere but what is the price/what is included in the kit?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 25, 2011, 07:03:09 PM
Curt,

It's actually not posted.  We've changed both the contents and pricing several times as we've made the kit more and more comprehensive (added halfshafts, added CV boots).  It will change once more if we add outer CVs.  Thus far we've been doing well at letting users keep total costs around $1800, it's just that we've been supplying more and requiring users to source less.

That said, pending a few details we might actually be nearing "release" one of these days.  For now I'll send you a PM with the current info. 

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on October 26, 2011, 10:53:04 AM
So where can I buy these outer CV's?  I'm just not having any luck locating them.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 26, 2011, 07:12:12 PM
unfortunately there will no testing updates from me for  a little while.   my motor developed a knocking noise and We're gonna tear it out and inspect and probably just rebuild it to  a 383 stroker with EPS 230 cam  :gruffy: :scratch:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on October 26, 2011, 09:17:05 PM
I have a '90 GLX (5-bolt hubs) that I am planning on doing this swap.  I know that the FC n/a and T2 rear CV axles have different inner bolt pattern, but what about the outer sections?  The reason I am asking is that I want to know if the T2 CV axle shaft outer section and spline will work with the stock n/a 5-bolt rear hubs.  I am slowly gathering the owner required sourced pieces/part for this kit and have been looking at salvage yard vs. re-manufactured FC T2 and Explorer rear CV axle shafts.  I just didn't know if I had to swap out anything else to make this work or not on my car.

TIA
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 26, 2011, 10:15:34 PM
Yes the hubs themselves are all the same. NA or T2 does not matter at all.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on October 26, 2011, 10:37:18 PM
Yes the hubs themselves are all the same. NA or T2 does not matter at all.

Okay great thanks, that answers one question. 

Now are the outer CV cages the same or different between the n/a and T2 CV axles shafts?  In other words, can I use the stock n/a axles on my GXL or do I need to find a set of T2 axle assemblies?

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 27, 2011, 12:37:52 AM
Quote

Now are the outer CV cages the same or different between the n/a and T2 CV axles shafts? 
The TII and NA outer CV joints are different.  The inner spline count for the TII is 26 and for the NA is 23?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 27, 2011, 12:40:37 AM
Lil update on my swap:
 
Its in:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01209.jpg)

I was able to drive it one time around the block.  My exhaust is hitting the front differential mount and after I fix that I will be able to provide further feedback.  The swap was performed together with a Mcleod Street twin clutch.  I will be throwing some hard launches on slicks on this this 8.8.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 27, 2011, 12:57:12 AM
I had to machine the subframe to clear the Strange 8.8 differential Yoke (1350 Ujoints) a bit like shown on the following picture. There is a verical reinforcement element inside the subframe and the opening is done just to that element (hard to tell from the picture).  The irregular finish is due to having welded the resulting joint:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01199.jpg)
 
Another minor modification was performed to the differential mount stops in order for them to clear the Explorer CV Boots:  I just cut a small section off both of them:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01205.jpg)
 
My driveshaft measured 32 1/2" center to center between front and rear Ujoints.  The differential Yoke used was the Strange U1630 and transmission Yoke was Moser TY650.  I have Grant's mount kit.  Engine is LT1 with T56 transmission mounted in the rear cradle holes.  Should be the same length for a SBC mounted in the rear cradle holes.
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01204.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 27, 2011, 01:07:57 AM
Regarding the 626 Turbo CVJoints:  They will fit nicely in the rear control arm openings:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01202.jpg)
 
The shorter splined shaft length seems to be just right after leaving out the 5 mm thick washer used with the TII axle shafts:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01207.jpg)
 
Here the whole rear before it was bolted back in place:
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01201.jpg)
 
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 27, 2011, 01:37:22 AM
Damn you guys are making me jealous.

Loving the homemade adjustable toe links Ricardo.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on October 27, 2011, 03:46:46 PM
looks good !
thanks for the Driveshaft info as I have not got mione "cut down" yet.
i'm using the grannys kit as well.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 29, 2011, 02:22:07 PM
One more little piece of information regarding the 8.8 Diff install:
Take a look at the following Ford Explorer mounting diagram and the 4B424 Insulator:  the rubber bushing used in the Explorer mount has the inner metal bushing protruding about 3/8" thru the bottom. If you mount the diff without any device that limits the diff case travel the front of the differential case will move downward about 3/8" untill it contacts the RONIN welded in support when letting off the gas.
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/4b424.jpg)
 
 
 The metal bushing protruding can be seen in this picture posted by Joel in page 1:
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/CIMG3060Medium.JPG)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 29, 2011, 02:59:48 PM
I fabbed my own insulator out of some delrin: 2 5/8" OD 1" ID 1/4" thick and cut a washer with the same OD and ID out of 1/8" rubber to munt under it.
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/Insulator.jpg)
 
 
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on October 29, 2011, 04:31:05 PM
Yup, I used a hard durometer rubber washer from a 3rd gen control arm bushing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 89vert on October 31, 2011, 11:36:12 PM
Well it happen ! Broke the Diff Axles. Can the Drive shaft shop's MAZDA 1989-2005 with Ford 8.8 Rear Conversion / 600HP Axle/Hub Kit work with the Ronin Explorer 8.8 Diff kit ? Putting down about 400 ft lbs of torque with Turbo II & 300mm axles.  [attachimg=1]
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 31, 2011, 11:42:12 PM
Got my front mount attached to my subframe today!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 01, 2011, 12:00:44 PM
Well it happen ! Broke the Diff Axles. Can the Drive shaft shop's MAZDA 1989-2005 with Ford 8.8 Rear Conversion / 600HP Axle/Hub Kit work with the Ronin Explorer 8.8 Diff kit ? Putting down about 400 ft lbs of torque with Turbo II & 300mm axles.


No,  the DSS axles are based on the harder to source cobra 8.8,  we use the explorer 8.8.  While the diff internals are interchangable, the axles are not. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ImportEvolution on November 01, 2011, 03:16:20 PM
Well it happen ! Broke the Diff Axles. Can the Drive shaft shop's MAZDA 1989-2005 with Ford 8.8 Rear Conversion / 600HP Axle/Hub Kit work with the Ronin Explorer 8.8 Diff kit ? Putting down about 400 ft lbs of torque with Turbo II & 300mm axles.  (Attachment Link)

I kinda jumped in here without reading but are those the oem tii stub shafts that are known to break?    If so I'm confused as to why the ronin kit would use those?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on November 01, 2011, 04:17:08 PM
Yes those are t2 stub shafts (I think), the Ronin kit doesn't use these. The 8.8 uses the explorer inner and the t2 outer coupled with a custom bar.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 89vert on November 01, 2011, 09:07:33 PM
Yes the pictures are from my stock TII. The DriveShaft Shop sells axles that are made for a ford 8.8 irs and turbo II ends and I was wanting to know if those would fit the Ronin Explorer kit. But as stated above those will not work.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ImportEvolution on November 01, 2011, 09:51:56 PM
Yes the pictures are from my stock TII. The DriveShaft Shop sells axles that are made for a ford 8.8 irs and turbo II ends and I was wanting to know if those would fit the Ronin Explorer kit. But as stated above those will not work.

I'm guessing it will be a while before your car will be able to break the explorer ones
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on November 01, 2011, 10:13:56 PM
The weak links in the base Ronin kit are the stock outer CVs. If wheel hop is not kept under control the outer CVs will get destroyed.

It is only natural that as the driveline components are upgraded, the weak links become more salient. It is good to see that the outer CVs are readily available new. They are reasonably priced and relatively easy to replace.

Ronin should get with the DSS and have them make a Level 2 axle package that would include the bar, outer CV and hub.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 02, 2011, 12:37:04 AM
Yes, we remove the first three links in the chain, generally as you go up in HP with the stock rear end failures tend to go 1) stub axles (as demonstrated above) 2) axle bars 3) ring and pinion, 4) outer cvs.

We'll likely get to a level 2 kit eventually but we want to make sure this is well sorted first.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on November 03, 2011, 01:15:41 PM
Where did you guys source the GKN 626 outer CVs?

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on November 03, 2011, 02:27:24 PM
I think I am the only lucky one that has been able to source them.  Its a local shop that specializes in new replacement CV joints that erroneously overstocked this item some time ago.  Its new old stock.  I can get some for you if needed.  PM me if interested.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on November 05, 2011, 02:30:41 PM
I don't think I have seen it posted yet but I spent a good amount of the day checking local yards for explorer rears.

I came up with some info that can help people in the search.


This is a chart of Ford axle codes that will be found on the driver door info tag.


Quote
Axle Codes

L - Limited Slip Differential
C - Conventional Differential

Code ... Ratio
41 ...... 3.27C
42 ...... 4.10C
43 ...... 3.08C
45 ...... 3.55C
46 ...... 3.73C
D1 ...... 3.27L
D2 ...... 4.10L
D4 ...... 3.73L
D5 ...... 3.55L

And this is a site that helps decode the actual tag found on the diff itself.  The build date part seems old/outdated but the axle ratio/differential callout is correct.

http://foureyedpride.com/joom/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=24:axle-tag-decoder&catid=23:fordmerc-decode&Itemid=40 (http://foureyedpride.com/joom/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=24:axle-tag-decoder&catid=23:fordmerc-decode&Itemid=40)



Helped me find a nice 3.73 limited slip :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Jax04 on November 06, 2011, 05:59:00 PM
Great Find Anti!   Did you end up picking that 3.73 up?   Ifso, where did you find it at?  Just curious, i did not stop into that place the other day to see if he still had it or not.  also, if you did pick it up, what did you pay for it?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on November 06, 2011, 09:12:34 PM
Interesting.  I knew my Explorer 8.8 IRS differential has a 3.73 gear ratio because of the 3L73 on the tag, but now I know that it was built in January 29, 2004.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 07, 2011, 11:36:21 AM
The "L" in 3L73 also references a limited slip.  The first digits on the tag should be 3 73 with a space instead of the "L" if it's an open diff (E.G. mine was a 3 55).
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on November 07, 2011, 10:07:21 PM
The "L" in 3L73 also references a limited slip.  The first digits on the tag should be 3 73 with a space instead of the "L" if it's an open diff (E.G. mine was a 3 55).

Hey, at least you got the 3.55  :)

BTW, the best price I have found on a TrueTrac for this differential is $435.  Has anyone found one for less?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on November 07, 2011, 11:25:55 PM
[BTW, the best price I have found on a TrueTrac for this differential is $435.  Has anyone found one for less?
[/quote]


Americanmuscle.com/ford  trac-loc 229.00 to the door . (standard equipment for the 03-04 cobras)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on November 07, 2011, 11:29:56 PM
here a pic[attachimg=1]
mine came w/3.55 "conventional rear" .
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on November 08, 2011, 07:43:30 AM
My came with the factory TracLok, although not the better '03-04 Cobra / GT500 grade friction material.  I want to upgrade to the TrueTrac because it works "better" on the road course and they do not need periodic maintenance.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 08, 2011, 10:11:31 AM
here a pic (Attachment Link)
mine came w/3.55 "conventional rear" .

That is a track lok, not an open diff.


Mine came with 3.73s and an open diff. It was out of an 05 Aviator.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 08, 2011, 10:17:20 AM
BTW, the best price I have found on a TrueTrac for this differential is $435.  Has anyone found one for less?

I got mine for $435 shipped. I had found them cheaper a couple years ago, but could not find them any cheaper recently.


Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 08, 2011, 01:12:10 PM
I paid $435 for my TrueTrak as well.

https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/p-3902-913a561-detroit-truetrac-limited-slip-ford-88-31-spl.aspx (https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/p-3902-913a561-detroit-truetrac-limited-slip-ford-88-31-spl.aspx)

I also ordered the Master IRS Rebuild kit as it comes with the axle bearings and seals (I'll keep you posted as need to verify they're the right ones for the explorer rear).

https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/p-1831-drk311amk-ford-88-irs-master-timken-bearing-kit.aspx (https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/p-1831-drk311amk-ford-88-irs-master-timken-bearing-kit.aspx)

The above is a little more expensive than some rebuild kits but it uses all Timken bearings.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 08, 2011, 06:56:05 PM
I got the Ford Racing 8.8 rebuild kit. It comes with Koyo USA bearings $89 shipped

http://www.buyfordracing.com/products/8.8%22--RING-%26-PINION-INSTALLATION-KIT.html (http://www.buyfordracing.com/products/8.8%22--RING-%26-PINION-INSTALLATION-KIT.html)

I also got a Ratech solid pinion sleeve.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on November 08, 2011, 08:18:43 PM
Sounds like I'm going to be the only one to run my diff as is for the first season.  I figured I'd give it a shot then decide if I want to just upgrade to cobra carbon clutches or a truetrack next fall.  Thinking way in advance here.  LOL
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 08, 2011, 09:52:50 PM
Sounds like I'm going to be the only one to run my diff as is for the first season.  I figured I'd give it a shot then decide if I want to just upgrade to cobra carbon clutches or a truetrack next fall.  Thinking way in advance here.  LOL

We are hardcore in So Cal.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on November 09, 2011, 05:15:10 PM
[mine came w/3.55 "conventional rear" .
[/quote]

That is a track lok, not an open diff.


 yeah, This pic is after the install.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 09, 2011, 05:31:12 PM
Nice.

As an FYI for those in the future -  There is no need to keep the ABS ring on the diff if you are going to pull it apart to swap components.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 13, 2011, 04:52:02 PM
Had my diff rebuilt and the TrueTrac installed. Joel and I were going to do the rebuild ourselves, but I had to have the car on 4 wheels again quickly because I'm on standby to get my exhaust done.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_01831.jpg)


And installed
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_01861.jpg)

I drilled the cover for a diff temp sensor, and used a 1/4 NPT 90 degree to 3/8 hose barb fitting for my vent. I will be running a rubber hose to a catch can that will have a vent on it. I had to remove some material from the fitting to get it to fit without hitting the diff mount.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 13, 2011, 05:06:49 PM
Before installing my 8.8 I weighed all the FC the differentials since I had them all out on the floor at once.

NA clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, with fluid - 73.2 lbs
T2 clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, no fluid - 91.8 lbs
Explorer 8.8 with Ronin FC rear diff mount fixture, delrin rear diff mounts, Mustang pinion flange, OEM rubber front diff mount and TrueTrac diff, no fluid - 84.2 lbs

*I believe the Truetrac is about the same weight as Ford Traction Lok. Their shipping weights are the same.

I suspect the hybrid halfshafts will be a couple pounds heavier per side than the TII shafts because they have the diff output shaft integrated into them unlike the TII halfshafts. This means the Ronin 8.8 setup will be the same weight or a few pounds lighter than a TII setup!

I will post the halfshaft weights when I get mine built.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on November 13, 2011, 06:26:52 PM
Before installing my 8.8 I weighed all the FC the differentials since I had them all out on the floor at once.

NA clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, with fluid - 73.2 lbs
T2 clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, no fluid - 91.8 lbs
Explorer 8.8 with Ronin FC rear diff mount fixture, delrin rear diff mounts, Mustang pinion flange, OEM rubber front diff mount and TrueTrac diff, no fluid - 84.2 lbs

*I believe the Truetrac is about the same weight as Ford Traction Lok. Their shipping weights are the same.

I suspect the hybrid halfshafts will be a couple pounds heavier per side than the TII shafts because they have the diff output shaft integrated into them unlike the TII halfshafts. This means the Ronin 8.8 setup will be the same weight or a few pounds lighter than a TII setup!

I will post the halfshaft weights when I get mine built.

"Your destroying the 50/50 weight balance"!

Another FC myth BUSTED!

Nice job guys! 8)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on November 13, 2011, 06:30:55 PM
I knew the second I picked up the explorer aluminum case 8.8 that it was light.  the cast iron case on the tii rear is very heavy.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ImportEvolution on November 13, 2011, 10:58:17 PM
Before installing my 8.8 I weighed all the FC the differentials since I had them all out on the floor at once.

NA clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, with fluid - 73.2 lbs
T2 clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, no fluid - 91.8 lbs
Explorer 8.8 with Ronin FC rear diff mount fixture, delrin rear diff mounts, Mustang pinion flange, OEM rubber front diff mount and TrueTrac diff, no fluid - 84.2 lbs

*I believe the Truetrac is about the same weight as Ford Traction Lok. Their shipping weights are the same.

I suspect the hybrid halfshafts will be a couple pounds heavier per side than the TII shafts because they have the diff output shaft integrated into them unlike the TII halfshafts. This means the Ronin 8.8 setup will be the same weight or a few pounds lighter than a TII setup!

I will post the halfshaft weights when I get mine built.


zbrown weighed the tii rear in at 220 pounds vs the solid 8.8 with grannys kit @ 193 lbs with .  I've read from a couple sites that that mustang irs is 80lbs heavier than the solid so I'm surprised this irs setup is going to weigh the same as the tii.    http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=4544.15 (http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=4544.15)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on November 13, 2011, 11:46:50 PM
Before installing my 8.8 I weighed all the FC the differentials since I had them all out on the floor at once.

NA clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, with fluid - 73.2 lbs
T2 clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, no fluid - 91.8 lbs
Explorer 8.8 with Ronin FC rear diff mount fixture, delrin rear diff mounts, Mustang pinion flange, OEM rubber front diff mount and TrueTrac diff, no fluid - 84.2 lbs

*I believe the Truetrac is about the same weight as Ford Traction Lok. Their shipping weights are the same.

I suspect the hybrid halfshafts will be a couple pounds heavier per side than the TII shafts because they have the diff output shaft integrated into them unlike the TII halfshafts. This means the Ronin 8.8 setup will be the same weight or a few pounds lighter than a TII setup!

I will post the halfshaft weights when I get mine built.

Thanks for the info!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 14, 2011, 01:29:19 AM
Before installing my 8.8 I weighed all the FC the differentials since I had them all out on the floor at once.

NA clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, with fluid - 73.2 lbs
T2 clutch LSD diff, stub shafts installed, no front or rear diff mounts, no fluid - 91.8 lbs
Explorer 8.8 with Ronin FC rear diff mount fixture, delrin rear diff mounts, Mustang pinion flange, OEM rubber front diff mount and TrueTrac diff, no fluid - 84.2 lbs

*I believe the Truetrac is about the same weight as Ford Traction Lok. Their shipping weights are the same.

I suspect the hybrid halfshafts will be a couple pounds heavier per side than the TII shafts because they have the diff output shaft integrated into them unlike the TII halfshafts. This means the Ronin 8.8 setup will be the same weight or a few pounds lighter than a TII setup!

I will post the halfshaft weights when I get mine built.


zbrown weighed the tii rear in at 220 pounds vs the solid 8.8 with grannys kit @ 193 lbs with .  I've read from a couple sites that that mustang irs is 80lbs heavier than the solid so I'm surprised this irs setup is going to weigh the same as the tii.    http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=4544.15 (http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=4544.15)

A Mustang IRS is not even close in design to the FC IRS. The diff is not what makes the IRS heavier in a Mustang. It is the subframe and arms.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: HTh3r0 on November 15, 2011, 11:59:57 AM
I can't wait to have my funds in order to start my 8.8.
Ever since I snapped an axle shaft in half, this went to the top of the winter project list. I don't think my t2 rear will appreciate the 150 shot.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on November 17, 2011, 05:49:41 PM
I also ordered the Master IRS Rebuild kit as it comes with the axle bearings and seals (I'll keep you posted as need to verify they're the right ones for the explorer rear).

https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/p-1831-drk311amk-ford-88-irs-master-timken-bearing-kit.aspx (https://www.drivetrainamerica.com/p-1831-drk311amk-ford-88-irs-master-timken-bearing-kit.aspx)

The above is a little more expensive than some rebuild kits but it uses all Timken bearings.

That is the same one that is on eBay;

http://www.ebay.com/itm/TIMKEN-INSTALL-BEARING-DIFFERENTIAL-KIT-FORD-8-8-IRS-/390338056100?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Model%3AExplorer&vxp=mtr&hash=item5ae1f60fa4#ht_2178wt_1140 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/TIMKEN-INSTALL-BEARING-DIFFERENTIAL-KIT-FORD-8-8-IRS-/390338056100?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&fits=Model%3AExplorer&vxp=mtr&hash=item5ae1f60fa4#ht_2178wt_1140)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Jarhead Steve on November 17, 2011, 08:13:03 PM
For reference sake, I weighed my 91 Supercoupe 8.8:


Iron Housing, Ring Gear (3.27 gears), Trac-lok, 28 spline Carrier, Pinon w/ flange, Stock Cover, no fluid
-87 lbs
Same, with both stub shafts
-101 lbs
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 3 fingered willy on November 18, 2011, 06:05:30 PM
A Mustang IRS is not even close in design to the FC IRS. The diff is not what makes the IRS heavier in a Mustang. It is the subframe and arms.
[/quote]

This is true.

For those that dont know, the mustang cobra IRS is very much the same suspension design as the old T birds, cougars ect. The real difference is the 31 spline vs 28 spline diff and the cast vs aluminum housing. Thats pretty much it. CV center bars are larger on the cobra, but not much was changed to make the cobra rear.

I haven't seen for myself but I'm sure some things weren't changed much for the explorer/navigator rear setup. But all in all its still the same base design that they used for so many years.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Jax04 on November 23, 2011, 09:19:11 AM
Just to clarify, i can order a mustang 8.8 spool and gear set and ill be good to go here?  Meaning, all parts are interchangeable?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 23, 2011, 11:26:58 AM
Just to clarify, i can order a mustang 8.8 spool and gear set and ill be good to go here?  Meaning, all parts are interchangeable?

Yes. I have an open diff I can sell you cheap if you are planning to run a mini spool.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Jax04 on November 23, 2011, 11:30:20 AM
Thank you, good to know  8)

At the moment, im just gonna get it here and get it in.   I appreciate the offer though  :halo:  When the time comes, before it ever goes to the track, i will be doing the rear end build and that jazz.

EDIT:  when i go pick this thing up, all i need is the inner stubs and the diff correct? I dont need the actual axles that rear had to begin with?

Im used to seeing Diff-> stubs -> Axles -> Outer stubs.

Im not sure how these come from the factory (explorer) if they are a single piece axle that slides into the diff or not. 


Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on November 23, 2011, 02:34:24 PM
yes you need the inner explorer stubs, which are part of the axle.  they come off the axles pretty easily though.  pop the boots off and the tripod slides right out of the stub, take the snap ring off the end of the axle and the tripod comes right off too.


we do need the tripods right?  haven't seen if they come with the upgraded axle bars or not.  i made sure to keep my stock ones.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Jax04 on November 23, 2011, 02:38:40 PM
Thanks for the clarification Antirotor.  Ill be sure to get the axles as well.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 23, 2011, 03:50:37 PM
yes you need the inner explorer stubs, which are part of the axle.  they come off the axles pretty easily though.  pop the boots off and the tripod slides right out of the stub, take the snap ring off the end of the axle and the tripod comes right off too.


we do need the tripods right?  haven't seen if they come with the upgraded axle bars or not.  i made sure to keep my stock ones.

You need the Explorer tripods, inner CV, and the little CV adapter so the CV boot will fit. The hybrid axle bars are JUST the bars themselves. If you cut the Explorer axles at the inner CV boot, you will have everything you need.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on November 24, 2011, 11:21:34 AM
Hey all you Beta testers, who is up and running these days and how is it going? How bout some feedback?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on December 15, 2011, 04:42:55 PM
I have put probably 500 miles on my setup without any issues.
The 3.73 ratio is great for a street/strip car and the freshly rebuilt POSI is working great. First gear was almost useless with a 4.10 gear ratio. I think my TII clutch type posi was shot before doing the swap.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on January 09, 2012, 12:23:31 PM
It's time to give the diff kit a proper launch.  All the feedback we've gotten from testers has been rolled in and changes required were very minor. 

As you may or may not have seen we also just launched a new version of our website.  www.roninspeedworks.com (http://www.roninspeedworks.com).  We also can now accept payment via paypal OR direct credit card processing via Authorize.net.

The diff kit is up and in stock now.  http://www.roninspeedworks.com/powertrain/ (http://www.roninspeedworks.com/powertrain/) 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on January 09, 2012, 03:26:07 PM
What comes with the diff kit? Is it just the mounts for the diff or does it include the custom halfshaft centers also?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RXTC on January 09, 2012, 04:25:57 PM
What is "Amigo" level of power?

This is what comes to mind when I think of Amigo Power :D

(http://www.mysuvchoice.com/includes/images/Isuzu_Amigo/90Isuzu_Amigo.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on January 09, 2012, 04:39:12 PM
Kit Includes:
•  Front Mount Support Cantilever (weld in)
•  Redundant Front Mount Strap (bolt on)
•  Rear Mount Diff Cradle (bolt on)
•  2X Custom 4340 heat treated axle bars (Ford to Mazda conversion)
•  2X EMPI CV boot kit 86-2127 (outer CV boots)
•  2X EMPI CV boot kit 86-2103 (inner CV boots)
•  Hardware:
-- 5/16-18 grade 8 bolts w/ washers support the Rear cradle
-- M10x1.5 bolts w/ washers tie down the Redundant Front Mount Strap
-- M12x1.75 bolt w/ deformed metal nut is the primary front mount hardware
-- Front mount isolation rubber
•  Instructions and specs
 
Donor Parts (Supplied by Users):
•  02-05 Ford Explorer Diff and complete inner halfshaft assembly.  You need everything short of the axle bar on the inboard end.  Note: 02-06 Lincoln Aviators and 02-05 Mercury Mountaineers have the same diff setup
•  T2 outer CV assembly (again everything short of the axle bar) 

Purchased Parts:
•  Rear diff mounts of the style of your choice
-- We recommend Mazda Comp mounts for a firm yet compliant setup.
-- We recommend MMR Delrin mounts to minimize all motion on track cars (comes at the expense of added noise/vibration/and harshness.)
•  Driveshaft and sub-components (lots of detail on options in the instructions.)


I have my hands on a set of the 626 CV outers, so we might do this instead of the outer CV boots once I get to try them out in detail, however the above is what the kit contains for now.


Amigo levels of power is a pure 65imp-ism.  We need to go through and make sure the descriptions are clear.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on January 10, 2012, 08:02:24 PM
Nice work on the website.

Joel and others like Ashley know that I have been slowly collecting parts for the LS1/T56 swap into the S5 GXL while still running the stock rotary.   My plans changed when I had to sell the other RX7, a S4 T2 roller and a SBF/T5 combo, because the wife has not worked in quit a while now.

I just picked up a lightly used 31-splice 8.8 TrueTrac to go in the '02-05 Explorer 8.8 differential I got awhile back.  Heck at the rate that I am going, I might as well just install the Ronin Ford 8.8 IRS kit in the car now with either 4.10 or 4.30 gears and run it with the rotary :)   I even have a spare 1-pcs aluminum drive shaft from a '93 Mark VIII that I can have cut down and have fitted with a yoke for the Mazda n/a trany.  It will still be under powered as hell, but it will be better than one wheel peal out of the corners.  As crazy as it sounds, it makes more sense that putting any money into the open 7" Mazda diff (like a Miata Torsen swap) that will eventually have to come out of the car. 

I would not be surprised if Joel sells a few of this 8.8 IRS kits to the high powered rotary guys that get tired of breaking their T2 units.

Keep up the GREAT work guys!   :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Infidel on January 20, 2012, 08:49:25 PM
Great Job on the kit, can't wait to pick one up as soon as I get some school bills payed off  :(, maybe late summer early fall. Kit seems reasonably priced for what you get.

In case i missed it do you include a guide on welding in the front mount section? If i do this kit i will definitely be welding it in myself, and was wondering how you go about this as it seems to be the only real fab part of the install. Basically is the position of the mount extremely critical by small increments, or is just put on the sub frame as it fits and welded?

thanks.   
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on January 21, 2012, 12:03:14 AM
Great Job on the kit, can't wait to pick one up as soon as I get some school bills payed off  :(, maybe late summer early fall. Kit seems reasonably priced for what you get.

In case i missed it do you include a guide on welding in the front mount section? If i do this kit i will definitely be welding it in myself, and was wondering how you go about this as it seems to be the only real fab part of the install. Basically is the position of the mount extremely critical by small increments, or is just put on the sub frame as it fits and welded?

thanks.

This is NOT a substitute for the full instructions, but in a nutshell, you remove the rear subframe and diff,  install the 8.8 rear fixture on your diff and loosely mount the diff in the car. Then loosely put the subframe in the car. Slide the front mount in place with the mounting hardware. Tighten the subframe and diff down, and apply pressure to the front mount/diff with a floor jack to keep the front mount aligned correctly. Double check clearances and fitment and tack weld the front mount to the subframe. Remove the subframe from the car, and finish weld the front mount.

It is pretty easy. That process took me about 30 minutes to do with Anthony. Having a 2nd person there really helps.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on February 15, 2012, 07:40:18 PM
1350 Ujoint clearancing.
 
I finally went ahead and installed my 3" aluminum solid Spicer Ujoint drive shaft and noticed I had to do some more clearancing for the Yoke on the DS.
 
this is how it went:
Aluminum driveshaft with 1350 U-Joints
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01244.jpg)
 
Cut in the subframe
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01245.jpg)
 
Fabricated Insert
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01246.jpg)
 
All welded up and ready to reasseemble
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01247.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 01, 2012, 10:13:22 PM
I am revisiting this thread with information that I have come up with about the 626 cv joints.  Earlier in the thread RX7V8Builder posted about finding some suitable outer cv joints from a late 80's Mazda 626 turbo.

I was excited about the replacement cv joint idea so I could sell my TII diff and axles as a package without having to steal the outer cv joints from them.  I still think it would be nice to get ahold of an outer cv joint that doesn't require tearing down good saleable axles, but I am not sure what to think about the 626 idea.

Unless I am totally off base, from what I found it doesn't look like GKN openly distributes their products in the United States.  I am sure big buyers could get them, but not the average joe.  So I went about finding other ways to source the 626 cv joints.  What I came up with is it seems most parts stores (Autozone, Advance Auto, Oreillys) sell either reman or brand new OEM grade cv axle shaft assemblies.  I would not buy any reman stuff after seeing a horrible video frijolee posted back in the day from a cv reman shop.  (look it up, its painfull to watch)  The going rate for a new axle seems to be about 70 bucks.

I bought a set of GSP brand new replacement cv axle shafts for a 1988 Mazda 626  turbo.  The part numbers are NCV47501 and NCV47502.  These list for $69.99 from Advance Auto but if you snoop around on retailmenot.com you can get significant online discount codes.  I got the axles for about $45 each and paid no shipping.

Well, these axles showed up today.  The splines do indeed match right up and fit in the hub and bearing very nicely.  The ones I got came with ABS trigger rings on them.  They were listed as correct fit for both ABS and non ABS 626's.  The trigger ring is a bit close to things on the RX-7 assembly so I would probably press them off if I was going to use them.  If you order the National Oil Seal #710393 that RX7V8Builder spoke of, the issue of the 626 56mm seal diameter vs RX-7 58mm seal diameter is easily handled.

The only problem is, they are short.  Short to the point that the nut will not be able to have the lip hammered into the lock groove at all.  Also, some spline engagement in the hub is lost.  I failed to bring home my caliper from work today but I did take some pictures and some rough measurements with a tape measure.

TII cv joint:  bearing shoulder to axle tip 4", bearing engagement length .5", bearing shoulder to end of spline a bit over 2.625"
626 cv joint: bearing shoulder to axle tip 3.5", bearing engagement length .5", bearing shoulder to end of spline a bit under 2.5"


So the 626 cv joint is .5"  shorter overall, and loses a little over .125" of spline engagement as well.  I do not feel very comfortable with this.  Anyone else have any other thoughts?  RX7V8Builder, did you get different results?

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/sidebyside.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/626nut.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/turbonut.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/626nonut.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/turbononut.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Demon on March 01, 2012, 10:27:01 PM
Spoken like a true machinist. The nut part can kind of be disconcerting, how much thread is there without a nut, maybe a shallow castle nut could be put on.  1/8th of an inch less spline engagement is nothing to worry about.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 01, 2012, 10:34:34 PM
I worry about dumb things.  That is why my car doesn't drive.   :yay:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on March 01, 2012, 11:00:47 PM
Yes, I noticed my CV joints were a tad shorter, but nothing to worry about:
Take a look at the lip of the nut already hammered into the stubshaft provision:

(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01207.jpg)

I've already put about 1000 miles on my conversion and have been to the strip once with no problems to report.
I have a set of CV joints at work that I will measure tomorrow and post so we can compare.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 02, 2012, 02:45:42 AM
Ricardo, you're running yours with no washer behind it correct?  That's likely the difference in nut engagement pictures.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 02, 2012, 07:16:43 AM
I happen to have a couple sets of the GKN 626 Turbo CV joints.  I will measure them tonight when I get home just to verify that theyare the same as what came on your new axles.  The differences you list are pretty close to what I remember when I compared them to a set of TII axels - unfortunately I didn't write the numbers down then.  The nut engagement seemed OK without the additional washer.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on March 02, 2012, 07:59:20 AM
Ricardo, you're running yours with no washer behind it correct?  That's likely the difference in nut engagement pictures.

Yes, I used the new supplied nut without the original washer on my install.  The washer with the kit includes a formed washer on one end.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 02, 2012, 10:17:36 AM
I will try to find a thinner nut then.  The nut that comes with the axle is a flanged nut with a washer built in also but maybe its not the same as yours.  I will probably go ahead and give these a shot.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 04, 2012, 03:03:35 PM
In case anyone is interested in using these CVs for their swap, I did a dimension comparison of a TII CV and one of the GKN CVs for a Mazda 626 Turbo.  I assume that it is the same CV that was shown as part of the complete 626 axle assembly shown by the OP.  The number stamped on the separate CV joint is:

  GKN  A8C151120196004  0006   

Here are the measurements in inches with the map in one of the attached pics

Dim   TII      626 Turbo
A   3.520      3.562
B   2.288      2.204
C   1.179      1.179
D   22mm x 1.0   22 mm x 1.5
E   .430      .390
F   .511      .509   
G   2.724      2.477
H   4.061      3.660
I   2.469      2.520
J   1.337      1.183

The dimensions of concern are G & J.  The overall engagement of the spline will be ~.25” less when using the 626 CV in the RX7 hub.  Since the spline length in the hub is approx. 1.43” which is nearly fully engaged with the TII CV the engagement length will be approximately 1.18”.  That may cause some concern by some.  The shorter length of the threaded section seems to be accounted for with the overall shorter height of the combined washer/nut that comes with the axle.

On a side note, since the pitch of the 626 axle thread is courser than the TII thread some minor adjustment of the tightening torque value might be in order – but probably not that critical.

Hope that helps anybody that might be considering this CV for their swap.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on March 04, 2012, 03:12:54 PM
I know the cradle was designed to work around the stock Explorer breather, but it was broken on my diff.  I was looking for a solution (like the air tool breather idea) and came up with a way to re-use the stock breather from my N/A diff.  It was simple and hopefully this will help others who run into the same problem.

Stock breather from N/A diff.  14mm socket to remove it.
(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-04_11-43-33_251.jpg)

The plastic sleeve in the Explorer diff.  I removed it, trimmed the top to make it flat, and used a 9/32" drill bit to open it up enough to screw in the new breather.  If a 9/32" bit isn't available a 5/16" would probably work.
(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-04_11-43-52_243.jpg)

After screwing in the Mazda breather.  This works on the same concept as drywall anchors and is very snug.
(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-04_11-49-39_859.jpg)

Just a little grinding to clear.
(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-04_11-59-36_962.jpg)

Installed and ready to go.  Lots of clearance, just hard to see in the pics.
(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-04_12-05-17_644.jpg)

(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-04_12-08-03_430.jpg)



Pay no attention to my hacked up diff cover.  It'll be cleaned up when I rebuild the unit.



Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 04, 2012, 08:16:25 PM
Be careful because that remaining plastic piece in the diff cover that you screwed the vent into can easily come out of the diff cover. Mine was aluminium not plastic, and I pushed it out with a screwdriver and a very light tap with a hammer.

My setup is not for everyone, but I removed the stock nipple and tapped the cover for 1/4 NPT. I used a 1/4 male NPT to 3/8" hose barb 90 degree fitting. I will be running 3/8" hose to a catch can. You could run a short length of hose and just put a filter in the end of the hose as well.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0254.jpg)
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0255.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on March 04, 2012, 08:27:52 PM
No it's more of a pressed fit, like a drywall or concrete anchor.  You know, like one of these....

(http://i01.i.aliimg.com/photo/v0/10833173/Plastic_Drywall_Anchor.jpg)

I know what you mean about it pulling out (I had to put it in my vice to drill it), but when I screwed in the breather it expanded the plastic tight against the bore.  I tried to pull it out, it's not going anywhere.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 05, 2012, 11:29:18 AM
Here is the Ford axle vent. I don't remember the thread pitch off the top of my head though.

(http://c1385782.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/lrs-4022a_4509.jpg)

http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/item/LRS-4022A/86-04-Mustang-88-Rear-Axle-Housing-Vent (http://www.latemodelrestoration.com/item/LRS-4022A/86-04-Mustang-88-Rear-Axle-Housing-Vent)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 05, 2012, 03:40:55 PM
The problem with the short breathers solutions is that they'll still spit a bit of fluid (or at least Charlie's did).  Running a hose out and upward is the preferred solution because it lets any fluid run back into the diff if it gets in the hose in the first place.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 05, 2012, 04:14:29 PM
The problem with the short breathers solutions is that they'll still spit a bit of fluid (or at least Charlie's did).  Running a hose out and upward is the preferred solution because it lets any fluid run back into the diff if it gets in the hose in the first place.

Agreed. The Explorer cover's lack of internal baffling can make a mess.

There is a TSB part for the Boss Mustang that may be helpful here. We could probably use this with a couple brass 90 fittings, and thread this part into it.

It is called the Turkey Baster, and is designed to collect small amounts of diff fluid and incorporates a vent. Ford part # AR3Z-4A058-B
(http://img830.imageshack.us/img830/9254/001kg.jpg)

It is designed to be use on the 8.8 axle tube and threads in but can also be used on the diff cover.
(http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/5214/496el.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: gc3 on March 05, 2012, 05:20:32 PM
wow i wonder why they call it a turkey baster :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on March 05, 2012, 08:33:46 PM
Ford uses a long hose on the Explorer cover. I did not know that originally and set up my vent like a Mazda diff cover. It didn't piss all over the place but there was definitely a good "misting" of gear oil all over the place after I got back from SNS 2011. I have since fitted a long tube to the cover and run it up and over to the left rear with a small rubber elbow on the end. Problem solved 100%.

I think that any of these that are hitting the track should consider long hose and vented catch can at least until we know how everything behaves when the diff temps are higher than street temps. Remember that Ford recommends 75w140 fluid. There is a factory TSB about it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on March 06, 2012, 02:13:54 PM
I think that any of these that are hitting the track should consider long hose and vented catch can at least until we know how everything behaves when the diff temps are higher than street temps. Remember that Ford recommends 75w140 fluid. There is a factory TSB about it.

Remember that the 75w-140 gear lub is for the factory clutch pack type Track Lock LSD.  If you switch to a gear type Eaton True Trac or Torsen LSD, then you can use 75w-90 gear lube.  High horse power or track only cars may want/need to look into a differential fluid cooler setup as they will be working their LSD pretty hard.

Also there was a TSB issue concerning the Explorer IRS 8.8 and gear whine - apparently they were note setup 100% correctly during assembly - hence the TBS about the switch to 75w-140 gear lub.  Check with a local Mustang shop in your area that has experience with working on and setting up the Mustang Cobra IRS 8.8 differentials.  It would be best to get the unit checked out or rebuilt and setup better than what the factory had done prior to installing it in your RX7.  Also since this is an aluminum case 8.8 IRS, if you are changing gears or LSD types, you will need special tool(s) to get the preset right for the proper bearing pre-load.  That is something the folks with the iron case T-bird 8.8 IRS or 8.8 stick axle folks don't have to worry about.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MXJS on March 07, 2012, 05:58:17 PM
I just read through the entire thread and I'm really considering one of these over a granny's solid axle.  I would like to see some results from a car with bias ply tires first.  Right now my car dead hooks with the TII diff and I have never had it wheel hop, I just need to change the gear ratio.  So maybe this will work well for me.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on March 11, 2012, 11:41:36 PM
Finally some progress.

(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/144.jpg)


I do have a couple questions though.  The first is regarding the crown caps and whether or not it would be ok for me to flip them to gain some clearance.  I'm running Mazda Comp bushings, don't know if that matters.  The second question is whether or not it looks like my pinion flange is lined up correctly.  I think it's fine, the cradle is straight and the front mount lined up where it was supposed to, but my buddy thinks we messed up. 

(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/159.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 14, 2012, 01:08:45 PM
Crown caps: the simplest thing to do is to put them in a press and flatten them by about 1/4".  Then trim the tips of the "crown points" to match.

Pinion looks correct.  The subframe is not symmetric so we place the diff such that the halfshafts are centered.  We measured this several different ways so I'm pretty sure it's right even though it will be offset vs the dip in the subframe.

-Joel

PS:  we have several kits in stock if others are ready to order.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on March 14, 2012, 08:37:12 PM
Cool, thanks.    :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on March 15, 2012, 01:22:16 AM
Heres a picture of my differential vent about 1200 miles after the 8.8 swap.  It includes one weekend at the strip with about 5 passes.  the rest is city and highway driving.
It has not leaked any oil at all.  I remember that there was a baffle just in front of the vent hole in y differential: a small piece of sheet metal held in place with a button head screw.  Besides, i dont think there should be any abrupt pressure changes inside the differential forcing the oil to the outside.
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DiffVent.jpg)
 
Maybe a track only car subject to higher temps and higher g-loads would need a vent system like the ones posted above, but for my street-strip application this has worked great.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 30, 2012, 05:14:33 PM
Just a note for those who are curious...

I just got a pair of '88 Mazda 929 axles from a junkyard for 20 bucks a piece.  This is where my outers will be coming from as they actually match the TII outer CV spine sizes exactly.  Same length, same grease seal, same threads, etc.

I will not be using the Chinese made GSP CV's.



Edit:

I actually ended up with 1 88 axle and one 89 axle.  Both are original Mazda, not remans.  I cracked them open today to find that the CV races and balls looked like brand new and were visibly MUCH better quality than the Chinese GSP parts.  You really couldn't see any appreciable wear marks on them at all.  I would highly recommend this as a viable solution if you either don't have a TII rear end, or don't want to split up your TII diff and axles.  It could also be an additional benefit that if you get 2 of the shorter side axles you could sell the axle bars as slightly beefier TII replacements to recoup some of the purchase cost.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wayne on April 08, 2012, 09:37:18 PM
If i bought this kit would i be able to use my new dss axles i just bought?
What is the fastest anyone has been with this set up? 1/4 mile.. (I would like to be the fastest! 8) )
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on April 08, 2012, 11:15:50 PM
If i bought this kit would i be able to use my new dss axles i just bought?
What is the fastest anyone has been with this set up? 1/4 mile.. (I would like to be the fastest! 8) )

Enzo holds the current FC IRS record, I believe. He did it on my old cobra rear cradle and DSS axles. I think he went 8.59.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 09, 2012, 05:12:53 PM
If i bought this kit would i be able to use my new dss axles i just bought?
What is the fastest anyone has been with this set up? 1/4 mile.. (I would like to be the fastest! 8) )

Sorry but no.  DSS axles required the Cobra inner stub axles (aka tulips).  While the guts of the diff are the same, the seal area and cases are not interchangeable. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: pork chop express on April 14, 2012, 11:44:29 PM
After the inital work/install, does this kit allow removal/installation of the diff without dropping the subframe?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on April 15, 2012, 05:13:58 PM
After the inital work/install, does this kit allow removal/installation of the diff without dropping the subframe?

I asked that same question, and was unfortunately told that the subframe will still need to be dropped to remove the Ford diff.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: pork chop express on April 15, 2012, 09:57:16 PM
 :(  :(  :(
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on April 16, 2012, 10:29:41 AM
:(  :(  :(

+1
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 16, 2012, 10:52:01 AM
Why is that a problem? After the swap is is actually easier to remove the subframe and rear suspension than with the stock diff. I can get mine out with the entire rear suspension in about 20 minutes now. It was about 30 minutes with the stock diff.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 16, 2012, 04:34:35 PM
-support rear of car on jack stands
-remove wheels
-remove rear calipers (body only) tie them out of the way
-disconnect bottom of suspension and sway bar (if you have it)
-disconnect drive shaft
-support entire rear end with jack at midpoint of a short 2x4 oriented fore/aft (supports both subframe and diff)
-loosen the primary hardware / subframe link and drop the assembly

Like LoF said this is a 20 minute job.  Not a big deal and no harder than OEM.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MXJS on April 16, 2012, 08:13:33 PM
I plan on ordering this soon.  Has anyone got any good 60ft times at the drag strip?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 89vert on April 16, 2012, 08:36:07 PM
I also would like to know about 60' times and high speed behaviors ?
Also in a picture rx7builder had the driver side axle looked like it had a little angle from the inter to outer half shaft ? Was it the picture ?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ALLslowNOshow on April 17, 2012, 08:17:49 AM
Call me crazy, but I just wanted to see something where I only need to undo the driveshaft, halfshafts and a few bolts to drop the diff. I guess I'm just lazy and we all should stick with Grant's engine mounts, cause hey "It's only a couple of lines you have to remove if you want to swap PS racks."
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Demon on April 17, 2012, 08:59:16 AM
Why should you have to remove it? The only thing you should ever remove it for is to change gear ratio.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 17, 2012, 10:57:35 AM
Call me crazy, but I just wanted to see something where I only need to undo the driveshaft, halfshafts and a few bolts to drop the diff. I guess I'm just lazy and we all should stick with Grant's engine mounts, cause hey "It's only a couple of lines you have to remove if you want to swap PS racks."

If it's possible to package what you describe it would mean sectioning  out a large enough chunk of the subframe to have the noise of the diff clear as it drops down and then having the having the diff front mount  support be a bolt on affair.  That means either a custom subframe or core charges, plus the front mount support gets thicker to take the bending loads.  That'd interfere with your exhaust routing...  It would basically double the cost of the assembly and that kills off what small market exists for this kind of product.

If there had been no good way around the power steering lines I'd say that was an appropriate compromise.  Unfortunately sometimes this does come down to convenience vs. effort vs. cost.   Heck, with a large enough budget I'll build you a rear end that changes itself at a button push.  ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on April 17, 2012, 01:07:55 PM
Call me crazy, but I just wanted to see something where I only need to undo the driveshaft, halfshafts and a few bolts to drop the diff.

OK, you're crazy.

I guess I'm just lazy and we all should stick with Grant's engine mounts, cause hey "It's only a couple of lines you have to remove if you want to swap PS racks."

Apples to oranges.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Aaron Venable on April 19, 2012, 10:57:21 AM
I haven't been keeping up with things, I guess this is done now?

I've seen the kit on the website, but it's pictured with a diff, some random brackets laying around and what looks like some safety wire?

From what I gathered it sounds like it includes everything needed with the exception of an 8.8 diff and Mazda outers. Is that right? The website description is not very detailed.

It would make things clear to have a separate picture of all of the parts supplied with the purchase.

thanks
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 20, 2012, 12:58:41 PM
Thanks for the commentary.  We'll see if we can't get a better picture.  In the meantime here's the info:

Kit includes:
•  Front Mount Support Cantilever (weld in)
•  Redundant Front Mount Strap (bolt on)
•  Rear Mount Diff Cradle (bolt on)
•  2X Custom 4340 heat treated axle bars (Ford to Mazda conversion)
•  2X EMPI CV boot kit 86-2127 (outer CV boots)
•  2X EMPI CV boot kit 86-2103 (inner CV boots)
•  Hardware:
-- 5/16-18 grade 8 bolts w/ washers that support the Rear cradle
-- M10x1.5 bolts w/ washers which tie down the Redundant Front Mount Strap
-- M12x1.75 bolt w/ lock nut is the primary front mount hardware
-- Rubber isolation for below the Ford front mount
•  Instructions and specs
 
Donor Parts (Supplied by Users):
•  02-05 Ford Explorer Diff and complete inner halfshaft assembly.  You need everything short of the axle bar on the inboard end.  Note: 02-06 Lincoln Aviators and 02-05 Mercury Mountaineers have the same diff setup
•  T2 outer CV assembly (again everything short of the axle bar)  <-- As mentioned this could change...
 
Purchased Parts (also Supplied by Users):
•  Rear diff mounts of the style of your choice
-- Recommend Mazda Comp mounts for a firm compliant setup --OR--
-- Recommend MMR Delrin mounts to minimize all motion (comes at the expense of added noise/vibration/and harshness.
•  Driveshaft and sub-components (lots of detail on options in the instructions.)
 
We have kits in stock so if you're ready to purchase you can place the order through our website.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Aaron Venable on April 26, 2012, 08:41:50 AM
Crystal clear.. Thanks

I'm interested in making this work with the larger DSS hubs and 33 spl outer CV's. They already make a similar halfshaft for the FD conversion, shouldn't be that hard to get a completely new setup from hub to inner. Sorry if this has already been covered, I'm not on the forums much these days...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on April 26, 2012, 05:59:05 PM
Crystal clear.. Thanks

I'm interested in making this work with the larger DSS hubs and 33 spl outer CV's. They already make a similar halfshaft for the FD conversion, shouldn't be that hard to get a completely new setup from hub to inner. Sorry if this has already been covered, I'm not on the forums much these days...

I am sure that Frank at DSS will work with you on the axles, but their current axle offerings will not work with the Explorer inner CVs. DSS makes axle for the Cobra inner CVs, which have a different spline on the bar that mates to the inner CV tripod.

Joel, you should give Frank a call and make the upgraded axles an option for people that are making big power. DSS already has the hubs and upgraded outer CVs available. All they would need is make a bar with the correct spline to mate with the Explorer inner CVs.

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on April 27, 2012, 02:24:36 PM
A couple quick questions.... anyone else other than largeorangefont running delrin bushings with the Ronin kit?  I haven't got my diff back from the rebuild to check and see if I am going to have the same pinion angle issues with the delrin bushings.  Just wondering if anyone else has seen that same thing?


Also, has anyone changed out the front rubber diff mount on the Explorer diff or is everyone just running it as is?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 27, 2012, 02:52:14 PM
A couple quick questions.... anyone else other than largeorangefont running delrin bushings with the Ronin kit?  I haven't got my diff back from the rebuild to check and see if I am going to have the same pinion angle issues with the delrin bushings.  Just wondering if anyone else has seen that same thing?


Also, has anyone changed out the front rubber diff mount on the Explorer diff or is everyone just running it as is?

Run it as is for now. It is a fairly complicated bushing to replicate due to its shape, construction, and how it is mounted in this application. I am running an angled delrin spacer between the diff and the subframe in front. I will probably have my spacer replicated in alumnium before I run the car. 

The kit comes with hard rubber spacers for this purpose. You will be able to adjust pinion angle by using washers in that area, but Honestly, my pinion angle is about perfect as is, but your mileage may vary.

I will be evaluating if there is even a need for a solid diff mount in front, At this point with a solid lower spacer the diff can't move very much if at all,  but we will see what happens when I get the car on the track.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on April 28, 2012, 08:53:43 PM
I'm a machinist so I could make the bushing pretty easy at work but the stock bushing is in good shape so I will probably give it a chance and see how it does.

I was thinking I had read you had issues with the delrin mounts not being able to move at all so you had to drill the holes out bigger or something?  I know when I put the delrin bushings in and put the diff up under the car it didn't want to move at all.  They are not going to allow any tipping forward or back as they are from MMR so I guess I am seeing the same thing.



In other news, I think it should be pretty much 100% expected to have to tear into the Explorer dif before using it.  I had a Ford tech take a look at mine and it had quite a bit wrong with it.  He was not surprised and warned me before he even looked at it that almost every one he has seen has been pretty beaten up.  When I found the diff it was already out of the car so I wasn't able to tell how many miles it had on it so maybe it was a ton.  He did say that he could tell it had never been taken apart before.  Essentially all I kept out of my diff was the housing, rear cover, carrier, and spider gears.  The clutches were completely worn out, the bearings had quite a bit of scarring in the races, one of the pinion bearings had spun on the pinion, and there were chipped and nicked teeth on both the ring and pinion.  So a whole new set of bearings, ring and pinion, carbon clutches, and seals later, I have a basically new rear.  He did say it would have run ok as it was at least for a while, but it would have been pretty loud.  After a proper rebuild he was confident there would be no further problems with this diff.

I guess the point I would take out of this is to find one for cheap as possible and not worry about if it is limited slip or what ratio is in it.  Just get it cheap and plan to set it up with the exact diff and gear ratio you want when you rebuild it.


I was told to make sure and use the 75w140 gear oil in these and not the lighter weight stuff.  Don't use the fill hole to fill the diff either as it will start spilling out of the hole before you can get the full 2 quarts in.  I was told to either stand it up on the pinion flange to fill it or fill it through the abs sensor hole.

There is also a Ford Technical Service Bulletin about replacing the axle seals with a new design that is much less prone to leaking.  This is TSB 06-22-5.  The seals are pretty expensive but apparently much better.

http://ford.justanswer.com/uploads/kennyz1963/2008-07-16_200342_tsb06-22-05.pdf (http://ford.justanswer.com/uploads/kennyz1963/2008-07-16_200342_tsb06-22-05.pdf)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DeaconBlue on April 28, 2012, 09:13:12 PM
I was told to make sure and use the 75w140 gear oil in these and not the lighter weight stuff. 

This is definitely the case if you plan to use the factory TrackLok clutch pack style LSD with either the normal or Cobra carbon fiber clutch lining material.  There was a TBS from Ford on the Explorer differential fluid change as well.

It you are using an Eaton TrueTrac LSD, you can stay with the 75-90W fluid.

If you are using the car as a track toy then you may seriously want to consider installing a fluid pump and cooler for the differential as well.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 29, 2012, 01:55:55 AM
Yes I had to drill out my diff bushings a bit to get the front of the diff to pivot up so it could land properly on the front mount. You will need to do the same thing.

My diff was from an 05 Aviator and it already had the newer outer seals. It was in great shape, with a claim of 55K miles although I could tell it had never been serviced. Mine did come with an open diff that got swapped out and I did a full rebuild anyway. As with any used part, you should inspect your diff before using it.

You will be able to get 2 quarts in by filling the diff in a normal manner, it is not a big deal. In any Ford 8.8 IRS you want to use 75W140 gear lube. The 75W140 gear lube spec is cast right into the Explorer diff cover
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MXJS on April 30, 2012, 02:38:37 PM
I just ordered this and I can't wait to try it out!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on June 17, 2012, 11:39:55 PM
1000 mile update:

So far so good.

I've only had one minor problem, and that has to do with one of the washers on the front mount.  I gave the car a 250 mile checkup and noticed the bottom washer had deformed, looking like it started to turn into a cone.  Maybe the cause has something to do with multiple launches at the strip, but my car only does mid 1.6x 60 ft times.  I don't know for sure, but I replaced the bolt, doubled up the washers, and everything has been fine since.  To be honest I'm not too worried about it.  The mount itself looked just fine.

I'll admit that in the beginning I was a little skeptical about eliminating wheel hop, but this setup really works, at least for my car.  I run drag radials have made 50+ passes down the strip and haven't had a single hop.  In the past if I spun off the line it would be wheel hop city but not now.  If it spins it'll just catch and go with no hop at all.  This is with drag radials.

I used all rubber bushings, so no delrin or solid mounts used.  New Mazda Comp diff bushings, and an oem Ford washer for the front diff mount.  The subframe mounts and all other bushings are 100% stock. 

The aftermarket outters, the same Ricardo used (thanks again buddy), seem to be just fine.  The oil seal on the hub needs to be changed but I think that has already been addressed. 

As I showed earlier in this thread, I reused the stock breather from my n/a diff and I've had no problems at all with oil spraying out from it.  I know there was some concern, but it's been working great for me.

So that's it so far.  Not much I can say other than I'm pleased with the swap.  This is a pretty simple swap and makes a huge difference in the car. 



Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on June 18, 2012, 08:13:14 PM
great to see it together. Any vibration loaded or unloaded? How quiet is it? Do you feel that it is as smooth as stock?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on June 18, 2012, 10:03:22 PM
No, no weird vibrations.  I do get some diff noise as a certain speed, but any slower or faster it goes away.  I'm not quite sure if it's something with the diff since I didn't rebuild it(low mileage unit), but I noticed it pretty much as soon as I started driving the car and it hasn't gotten any worse.  I'm thinking it's some sort of harmonics that's transferring to the car.   As for if it's smooth as stock, I say a little more so, especially under load.  My old n/a diff and bushings were plum wore out, and I knew it.  I installed a pinion snubber and that helped but it still didn't feel solid like this setup.

I'm curious about your questions though.  What have you experienced?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on June 19, 2012, 09:03:37 PM
Anyone have anymore detailed pics of how the diff case and front mount fit together?  I think I have looked over every pic in the thread and I must be confused or something.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on June 20, 2012, 12:28:23 AM
Does this help?  This was taken after the first test fit. 

(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/2012-03-03_17-31-55_291.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on June 20, 2012, 01:16:29 AM
Heres another shot showing the whole assembly waiting to go in
I had already posted this one.
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01201.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on June 20, 2012, 06:26:46 AM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/IMG_12201.jpg)

More like a close up of right here.  How much did you have to trim the front diff mount or the subframe in front of it?  Mine are touching right now and I am planning to do some clearancing at work later.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on June 20, 2012, 09:09:01 AM
I did get some metal to metal contact right at the spot you are showing in your picture.  I noticed that after about 600 miles when I tore it down to clearance the subframe for the 1350 Ujoints.
 
I then cut about 1/4" from the contact point towards the toe link fastening point and ground the bottom weld completely flat.  I dont have a picture of the final mod.
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01241.jpg)
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01240.jpg)
 
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 20, 2012, 12:50:17 PM
Clearancing the point you guys reference was added to the install instructions after Charlie first found this. 

That said, some of the pictures above are better than I currently have so I may use those in a revision to the instructions. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on June 20, 2012, 10:05:17 PM
I notched the subframe in front of the front diff mount and welded in a patch today.  Now I have a small gap between the subframe and the diff mount.

Excuse the terrible welding.  I'm still a rookie and don't do well following curves/getting in corners etc.  LOL

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/IMG_12312.jpg)


I also skimmed about a 2-3 degree angle on the tops of my MMR delrin diff mounts to get the nose up a bit which seemed to help a lot.  I had already slightly elongated the holes as largeorangefont said he had to do but that didn't seem to be enough.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Kovah41 on June 21, 2012, 07:59:51 PM
You guys have this kit in stock? Got my money up and time to order!!!!!! I can not wait to feel the difference!!! Great work and cant wait to try install and get sideways.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 21, 2012, 09:27:10 PM
You guys have this kit in stock? Got my money up and time to order!!!!!! I can not wait to feel the difference!!! Great work and cant wait to try install and get sideways.

We do.  You can order through the website whenever you're ready.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Kovah41 on July 02, 2012, 09:36:35 PM
Order placed and cant want to get this and install!!!!! Its gonna be like xmas in july when UPS shows up lol. Thanks again guys
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 06, 2012, 09:59:44 AM
Joel, does the case with the dual front mount bushings interfere with the mounting? It looks like it might be close on the drivers side of the subframe...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 06, 2012, 11:49:33 AM
Joel, does the case with the dual front mount bushings interfere with the mounting? It looks like it might be close on the drivers side of the subframe...

Correct.  Our kit is designed to work with the single mount explorer/navigator/mountaineer versions only.  Packaging is notably better with the single mount.  If you use a dual mount you could potentially use our rear cradle but the front will be all custom, you may need to move the subframe link over etc.  This is why andrewb70's version had to have folks sending in their subframes, involved core charges etc.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 06, 2012, 12:38:17 PM
Aww man.....so, can I hack off the drivers side mount on the case or is the case different other than the additional mount bushing?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 06, 2012, 01:11:00 PM
Aww man.....so, can I hack off the drivers side mount on the case or is the case different other than the additional mount bushing?

The Explorer style case is different than the dual mount cases.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 06, 2012, 01:41:49 PM
Hmmm. the seller said its from an 05 exploder. He explained they changed the case design in 05 or 06 to the dual mount....Is this accurate?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 06, 2012, 03:27:44 PM
Hmmm. the seller said its from an 05 exploder. He explained they changed the case design in 05 or 06 to the dual mount....Is this accurate?

They changed the case to dual front mounts in 06. I have a case from an 05 Aviator in my car and it is the single mount. If it is an 05 you are getting, you should be fine.

I have not personally measured the front mounting pattern for the dual mount Explorer diffs so I am not 100% certain but I doubt Ford just "added" a mount to the driver side of the diff and left everything else the same with the 06 Explorer case revision. The IRS Cobra diff housing with its dual front mount is entirely different in size and positioning than the Explorer housing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 06, 2012, 04:12:28 PM
I better take some pictures when I get home to verify. I'm getting nervous now....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 06, 2012, 06:51:59 PM
Guys,

Just wanted to share what I had made up this week. I'm running solid subframe and rear diff mounts with my Ronin 8.8 kit and wanted a solid spacer for the front diff mount to keep the front of the diff from moving. I am still using the Explorer rubber front diff mount, but these spacers should keep the diff pretty well captured with the Ronin mounting hardware.

These are made from 2" diameter alumnium with a 1" hole in the center. I had 3 spacers made, each with a different bevel to set the pinion angle (I was not 100% sure what angle I needed) They are 1, 1.5, and 2 degrees, with the thin side of all the spacers being 3/8".

I will post which one worked the best once I get them installed this weekend.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0447.jpg)
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0448.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 06, 2012, 11:59:54 PM
Nice spacers largeorangefront! Here are the pics of my diff. Sorry they are crappy Iphone pictures.
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/IMG_04911.jpg)
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/IMG_04901.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 07, 2012, 12:41:23 AM
Ok will that is definately an 06+ Explorer case.. maybe they did just add a mount to the drivers side. Measure from the pinion center line to the passenger mount centerline. Also measure from the front of the pinion flange to the passenger mount centerline.

One of us can compare to see if it is close or even the same. Youll still have to lop off that entire driver side mount. Not sure if you want to do that or get another case.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 07, 2012, 01:04:44 AM
I'll measure it this weekend. I got the whole thing for $325. It's been rebuilt by a local ford tech with new bearings, seals, 3.55 gears, etc. everything inside is new...Id hate to let it go...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 09, 2012, 01:55:48 AM
One of the few parts of this installation that can prove to be a bit challenging is pulling off your donor outer CV's.  A few folks have run into an axle that just proved stubborn (it's been maybe one guy in five).   I wanted to come up with a way to kick ass and take names just in case other folks had the same problem that was a little more elegant than big hammers (even nice brass ones).

So I made a tool...

Finished split ring on the left started life as the bit on the right.
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/7DSC_0937Custom.JPG)

Daddy's little helper.  Bottom half clamped to the axle.
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/7DSC_0938Custom.JPG)

24 tons of bottle jacks, something going to give.  Split rings push directly on the inner race.  Top half is a slip fit.
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/7DSC_0939Custom.JPG)

Not a problem.
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0118Custom.JPG)

Like I said, usually you can find the direction the ring wants to sit and it'll just pop free.  In this case we couldn't get it to seat right and we pushed hard enough that it tore some of the splines off the axle.
(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0120Custom.JPG)

If you get stuck, hit me with a PM or email to roninspeedworks@gmail.com and we'll do it for you. 

-Joel (for the Ronin)





Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on July 09, 2012, 08:58:03 AM
Holy crap, haha.   Me = fan of overkill.  :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 09, 2012, 11:26:45 PM
Mine is all in for the final time. I ended up using the 1.5 degree spacer to get the pinion angle where I wanted it.

Also I weighed the assembled hybrid halfshafts against the TurboII halfshafts. The hybrid halfshafts are about 4 lbs heavier each. That makes the weight difference about a wash for this swap.


Plenty of thread contact with Turbo 626 outers and no washer. Axle is flush with the nut.
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2236.jpg)

Looking down the back of the hub, you can see where the boot clamp sticks out. The DTSS bushing is already beveled and the clamp clears.
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2237.jpg)

Basically ready to go. I ended up needing a slightly longer sublink (about 1/4 inch) with my solid front mount spacer. I installed a Ground Control unit today and it fits great with plenty of clearance around the diff housing. I also installed the small CV boot clamps after I took this. I removed the axle seal covers from the Explorer inner CVs. I don't plan on taking the car out in the mud or dirt so I figure those weren't needed.
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2238.jpg)

Soild spacer installed
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2239.jpg)

Driveshaft clearance - the weight is about 1/4 in from the subframe - Whew that was close
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2241.jpg)

Mustang pinion flange and yoke clearance
(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2242.jpg)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: IFRYRCE on July 10, 2012, 12:40:10 AM
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/IMG_12201.jpg)

More like a close up of right here.  How much did you have to trim the front diff mount or the subframe in front of it?  Mine are touching right now and I am planning to do some clearancing at work later.


I notched the subframe in front of the front diff mount and welded in a patch today.  Now I have a small gap between the subframe and the diff mount.


I also skimmed about a 2-3 degree angle on the tops of my MMR delrin diff mounts to get the nose up a bit which seemed to help a lot.  I had already slightly elongated the holes as largeorangefont said he had to do but that didn't seem to be enough.

Okay, cool, so I am not the only one facing this. Just ran into it today in the garage, will try and deal with it tomorrow.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 10, 2012, 10:39:46 PM
Ok, I hope I measured the correct places. How do these measurements look?
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/IMG_0500.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on July 21, 2012, 12:48:54 PM
just ordered the kit for my auto lt1 fc. 3.55 gears, and it will be welded. yes welded
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on July 23, 2012, 01:29:00 PM
Can Ronin verify if those measurements are the same as the single mount cases?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on July 27, 2012, 04:44:20 PM
Largeorangefont:

What u-joints did you wind up with?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 28, 2012, 12:14:30 PM
Largeorangefont:

What u-joints did you wind up with?

I believe they are 1310s. I bought Bowtie7's driveshaft when he swapped his out for a carbon fiber shaft. He had it shortened and rebalanced for the Ronin engine mounts.

I am not drag racing, so I think the 1310s will be fine.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on August 01, 2012, 10:15:55 PM
Ok I was just curious.  I'm also running 1310 joints.  I do drag race but I'm only ~300 whp so they should be more than plenty.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on August 06, 2012, 07:09:23 PM
I'm curious of what would be the limit (drag racing)  on running 1310s as i'm hoping to put 500 to the wheels and weigh 2800 lbs ?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 06, 2012, 07:43:26 PM
I'm curious of what would be the limit (drag racing)  on running 1310s as i'm hoping to put 500 to the wheels and weigh 2800 lbs ?

Denny's states 400 hp
http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/frequently_asked_questions.html#faq_id9 (http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/frequently_asked_questions.html#faq_id9)

However there are quite a few guys who claim you can get more.  Case in point:
http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showpost.php?p=896234&postcount=15 (http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showpost.php?p=896234&postcount=15)

We recommend 500 rwhp as about the dividing line.  If you're doing a lot of drag I suggest the 1350's both because of the repeated hammering and because the temptation for more power is always going to be there.  If you want to push 1310's I suggest the permanently lubricated versions as eliminating the zirc fitting eliminates a stress riser inherent to the grease-able version.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on August 10, 2012, 12:57:54 AM
Thanks .
I'll with the 1310s as I won't be a regualr bracket racer .
work schedlue would allow it anyway. ;)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on August 17, 2012, 11:55:29 AM
It looks like my pinion is in the correct place. just want to make sure before I weld. front mount and hardware are in all lined up.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 17, 2012, 12:09:18 PM
That looks good from here.  In terms of elevation, check that the upper surface of the cantilever extension is pretty much flush with the upper surface of the subframe lip aft of the tie rod.  The bottom of the diff case mounting point ends up being supported by both.

You may need to open up the "fish mouth" on the side of the cantilever support closest to the pinion slightly.  That's one optimization that's coming out of what I'm finding as I work on my own installation.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on August 17, 2012, 12:16:25 PM
ok cool, will check tonight after work. im the one that got the powercoated axles, along with the front mount that was trimmed up, it fits well. i will double check the fish mouth tho.   
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: 65imp on August 17, 2012, 03:02:20 PM
enjoy those axles  :yay:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 17, 2012, 04:25:44 PM
ok cool, will check tonight after work. im the one that got the powercoated axles, along with the front mount that was trimmed up, it fits well. i will double check the fish mouth tho.

Check it, but you likely shouldn't need to do more.  That's the optimization I was alluding to.  When I figured out what I wanted changed I did that for you and for the other the remaining kits in stock.  It was never a big deal but we're still changing the CAD cutting file going foward so fitment is as easy as possible. 

We're also adding a zinc finish to the next batch of axles (presently in production) so users won't need paint or powder anymore.  Continuous improvement baby.  We aim to please.

-Joel

PS Isn't Mike a bad ass with a powder gun?  The metallic charcoal with just a tinge of purple is such a great color... 

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on August 18, 2012, 03:33:35 PM
Hey Joel, I posted the measurements for the dual mount diff, is there a way we can verify if the diff is compatible if  I hack off the drivers side mount?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on August 18, 2012, 08:19:17 PM
Ok, I hope I measured the correct places. How do these measurements look?
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/IMG_0500.jpg)

Sorry about that.  When you first asked all my parts were packed so I was hoping someone else could chime in.  I dug out my parts and here's what I found.  I think it'd be pretty close.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0551Custom.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0552Custom.JPG)

Note, there are a few more dimensions needed. 

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0553Custom.JPG)
-The total fore/aft position relative to where the bolt heads go (landing surface for our rear cradle).  That's the surface I'm hooked up on, it's not the cover to housing split line.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0554Custom.JPG)
-We have to check the elevations of the mount in the side view.  Top looks like it's in line with the halfshaft centerline...

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0555Custom.JPG)
-Mount is 2 3/4" tall including the protrusion out the bottom

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0556Custom.JPG)
-The position of the mounting hardware and ribs.  I centered it on 5" so you can do a ballpark comparison.

Check it out and see what you think.  Is your mount support the same thickness as mine?
-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on September 10, 2012, 12:13:01 AM
swap finally finished! took a test drive today and dam what a difference some longer gears make. 3.55s running a full spool makes for a fun street car  :D. best mod to the fc yet. definitely a must!!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 11, 2012, 12:51:42 PM
swap finally finished! took a test drive today and dam what a difference some longer gears make. 3.55s running a full spool makes for a fun street car  :D. best mod to the fc yet. definitely a must!!!

Thanks for the feedback and we're glad you like it!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on September 14, 2012, 01:00:11 AM
I just have one question, I ended up reusing the factory camber bar(chassis to the sub-frame one) instead of the adjustable one i have. can i still use the adjustable one or should I get the individual ones?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 14, 2012, 11:09:11 AM
I just have one question, I ended up reusing the factory camber bar(chassis to the sub-frame one) instead of the adjustable one i have. can i still use the adjustable one or should I get the individual ones?

You could use the adjustable one, but keep in mind that it will change your pinion angle and could introduce vibration. You could shim the bottom of the front diff mount to get back to the pinion angle you need after preloading the subframe.

The individual adjusters are a better solution and will give you a proper alignment on both rear tires anyway.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: LSRX7 on September 21, 2012, 02:17:53 PM
It would appear from previous posts that some individuals are cutting their subframe for driveshaft/pinion flange clearance while others are not? Also, is it absolutely necessary to cut the crown caps to keep them from contacting the inboard CV joint?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 21, 2012, 02:59:16 PM
Pinion flange/yoke clearance is entirely decided by what driveshaft you decide to run. If you go with the small Mustang style flange and yoke there should not be any clearance issues. If you go with 1350 joints and yokes you will need more clearance.

I run the Mustang setup with 1310 joints and an aluminium driveshaft. See my pictures in the previous couple pages. You will just want to make sure the driveshaft shop uses low profile weights to balance the driveshaft. My weights com close to the subframe.


Here is the crown cap recommendation from Joel. If you run OEM bushings this should keep you from having to "D" the caps.
Crown caps: the simplest thing to do is to put them in a press and flatten them by about 1/4".  Then trim the tips of the "crown points" to match.

With solid diff bushings you just crank them until they bottom out against the bushing and torque to spec. You can see mine are completely collapsed in the pictures and I have over 2 inches of clearance.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 21, 2012, 08:57:57 PM
Ash has it right.  If you want to run 1350 u-joints you'll need to do some added clearancing on the subframe.  If you stay with 1310s (fine for road race, all street cars, and most stock cube, n/a drag applications) you shouldn't need to do that.

It looks like the simplest solution on the "crown washers" is to run the Mazda Comp bushings and cut the internal bushing sleeve down on the bottom side so that the entire crown assembly rides a little higher than normal.  That's basically what Ash ended up with for his particular solid diff bushings (remind me which brand of diff bushings you're running amigo?).
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 22, 2012, 01:04:31 AM
I'm running MMR bushings. The "compress" solution should work with all solid diff bushings as I have not seen any that protrude below the diff itself.

I like the idea of slicing down the inner sleeve of the mount itself when using OEM style mounts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on September 24, 2012, 11:49:32 PM
i was hoping to turn out some 60's for you guys this weekend  on my slicks but the hinson clutch line burst while i was in line ready to go  :(
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on October 17, 2012, 04:27:06 PM
works good on the street vs a ls1 cammed notch with solid axles, drag radials,  traction arms, drag shocks =)

my cars on  direzza starspecs and BC  coilovers =)


<object width="1280" height="720"><param name="allowfullscreen" value="true"></param><param name="movie" value="https://www.facebook.com/v/516378525056388"></param><embed src="https://www.facebook.com/v/516378525056388" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="1" width="1280" height="720"></embed></object>
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on October 20, 2012, 11:30:59 PM
Can't view the vid
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: LSRX7 on November 14, 2012, 04:23:19 PM
Any testimonials of how well this product performs and what folks think in general?

Also, from the attached list below, which diff should I purchase?

Thanks in advance for your help!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on November 14, 2012, 04:29:29 PM
I'm finding there is lots of confusion around terminology with diffs and related parts. Talk to the yard. I think you want an Explorer diff 2002 to 2005 with diff mounted ABS sensor and the ratio of your choice (at least I'm sure that works). In my searching I've seen many of those pop-ups with different choices in them. (I think hub mounted sensors are for traction control - RCS)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 14, 2012, 06:03:32 PM
You want a 02-05 rear carrier/pumpkin/housing out of an Explorer, Mountaineer or Aviator. It does not matter if it has the housing mounted ABS sensor or not. You can buy the ABS sensor delete plug for a couple bucks from your Ford dealer, or cut the wires off your sensor and leave it in.

They only come with 3.55 and 3.73 gears,  and with open or Trac Loc LSD diffs. Any combo of those gears and diffs are possible. You can read the axle tag to see what gear and diff is inside a housing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on November 14, 2012, 06:39:09 PM
Any testimonials of how well this product performs and what folks think in general?

Also, from the attached list below, which diff should I purchase?

Thanks in advance for your help!

I think I pobably have the most miles on mine and I am really happy with it. I thought I had a vibration related to the swap but it was actually in the transmission and it is all fixed now and really smooth. It rips when I want it to.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 15, 2012, 12:16:49 PM
You want a 02-05 rear carrier/pumpkin/housing out of an Explorer, Mountaineer or Aviator. It does not matter if it has the housing mounted ABS sensor or not. You can buy the ABS sensor delete plug for a couple bucks from your Ford dealer, or cut the wires off your sensor and leave it in.

They only come with 3.55 and 3.73 gears,  and with open or Trac Loc LSD diffs. Any combo of those gears and diffs are possible. You can read the axle tag to see what gear and diff is inside a housing.

Correct.  I believe the 06 aviator was a carry over as well (the single sided front mount will be visually apparent), but any 02-05 is safe.  If you want to upgrade the LSD, going with an Eaton TruTrac (helical gear) is only about $450 so I wouldn't shy away from a good deal on a open diff.  To keep the car a bit more spritely 3.73 gears are great all around.  3.55s are perfect if you're making extra power or it sees a lot of highway time.  You can get about any gear ratio desired for minimum $$$ if you have special needs.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: LSRX7 on November 19, 2012, 02:58:06 PM
Thanks for all the info guys!

Joel - Do you happen to know if this rear axle cover would work with your kit - http://www.fordracingpartsdirect.com/FORD_RACING_8_8_INCH_ALUMINUM_REAR_AXLE_COVER_p/m-4033-k.htm (http://www.fordracingpartsdirect.com/FORD_RACING_8_8_INCH_ALUMINUM_REAR_AXLE_COVER_p/m-4033-k.htm)

Edit - looks like it only fits solid axle.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 19, 2012, 05:36:18 PM
The Boss/Shelby finned rear diff cover will fit but would need to grind on it, and the vent may interfere when you install it because it is not in the exact same position as the Explorer cover.

You would also need to drill and tap it for drain and put a fill plug on it somewhere. The boss at the top of the cover is for a diff cooler, and would overfill the diff if used as a fill.

The OEM Explorer cover is about the best cover to use for this application. It allows a bit more capacity and has some cooling fins on it. Shelby actually used it on the GT500 KR (with the mounts hacked off) before the finned Ford unit came out in 2011.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 20, 2012, 02:24:16 PM
As usual Ash knocks it out of the park... 

-bolt pattern should be the same so yes it fits
-you do need to take a few fins off to clear
-you may need to clearance the ronin mount for the vent
-the explorer rear cover is already quite heavily fined.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: LSRX7 on November 20, 2012, 04:23:53 PM
Yep, Explorer cover it is...

Picking up an 05 Explorer carrier/pumpkin with 3:55's next weekend. I think Im just going to stick with the Traction-Lok diff as it seems to be a widely used and solid unit.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 20, 2012, 05:43:35 PM
Good choice, You won't be disappointed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on November 22, 2012, 10:39:59 PM
this is a MUST do for any FC. 03 mountaineer diff with 3.55s and a full spool. perfect for my auto lt1/700r4 street car.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on December 02, 2012, 09:30:39 PM
You'll love the swap.  I have over 6k miles and at least a hundred drag passes since completing my swap in May.  It's a solid kit.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on December 03, 2012, 06:40:21 PM
I can still get a hold of these CV joints if anyone should need a set.
PM me if interested.
I have been running them in my conversion for a while now with 400WHP

(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00125-20111018-1735.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Kovah41 on December 04, 2012, 07:26:31 AM
this is a MUST do for any FC. 03 mountaineer diff with 3.55s and a full spool. perfect for my auto lt1/700r4 street car.

Hey bro, was wondering how that spool is workn out for ya. I got a 02 explorer diff with 3.55 and need it locked at all times. Where did you source your spool from? I really dont want to weld mineand trying not to have shell out 500the bucks. Thanks bro
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on December 04, 2012, 10:22:19 AM
this is a MUST do for any FC. 03 mountaineer diff with 3.55s and a full spool. perfect for my auto lt1/700r4 street car.

spool for a street car?  hard core.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on December 05, 2012, 10:18:56 PM
got my spool off of Ebay, paid around $100 for it. its a off brand but it works all the same. tires make noise on tight turns, sure it can be annoying at times but, always spins both tires  :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on January 21, 2013, 07:40:42 PM
I finished assembling my axles on the weekend. Here is how they look with the zinc plated shafts.[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on January 21, 2013, 07:57:27 PM
New outers! Nice! I just finished the complete install on the race car with 3.73 gears and all new internals using Mazdaspeed mounts. Track testing on 30 January and weather permitting will race at Carolina Motorsports Park weekend of 8 Feb. Hopefully Russ will be super comfy and do well!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on January 21, 2013, 10:31:43 PM
Yup, I took Ricardo up on his offer just above. I changed the internals also and went with 3.55's. Tousley ford is just down the road from me. I love new parts.  ;)

This won't be finished for awhile though. I don't have a heated garage and the high today was -5F. I'll use Mazdaspeed mounts too except for the subframe mounts which are solid.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on January 22, 2013, 10:24:10 AM
Tousley ford is just down the road from me. I love new parts.  ;)
Steve

Lucky bastid!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on January 23, 2013, 02:05:35 PM
No mention of snubbers in this thread. Does that need go away with the swap ?

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on January 23, 2013, 02:13:33 PM
You can toss the snubber.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on January 23, 2013, 03:32:18 PM
No need for a snubber.  Our use of the front mount is much more effective than Mazda's original design. 

Then again, the Explorer is a much heavier vehicle and already intended to be used with an engine making a good amount of torque.  As such, maybe I shouldn't fault Mazda's design when we're all running this far outside of the normal operating ranges.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on February 12, 2013, 08:33:11 PM
oddly enough I still get wheel hop with my vehicle even with solid diff mounts and  DTSS elims
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on February 12, 2013, 10:31:39 PM
oddly enough I still get wheel hop with my vehicle even with solid diff mounts and  DTSS elims

Hmm - I believe that you are the only one who has said that wheel hop was still a problem with this kit installed.  What is different about yours compared to the others that are running this?  I would be really interested in what the Ronin guys have told you since it seems like yours is unique.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 13, 2013, 03:47:00 PM
It's the first time I've heard of anyone getting wheel hop.  Quite a few folks have chimed in to say their setup was the first FC they'd ever driven that didn't hop.

A few thoughts:
-We recommend folks torque down the front mount before torquing the slotted side strap bolts. 
-Are you running isolation under the OEM Ford front mount?  (we added that after the first few kits).
-You still need to be sure your shocks and the rest of the bushings are good.
-Tire selection and balance sometimes play an issue too.

Phil (or anyone really), if it does hop on you, get out of it as the hammering is no good for parts.  If you'd like, shoot me a PM or email at roninspeedworks@gmail.com and we'll chat offline about what else we could investigate.

-Joel Payne
(for Ronin Speedworks)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: andrewb70 on February 17, 2013, 10:05:39 PM
Joel,

Glad to see this is working out well for everyone!

Andrew
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 23, 2013, 03:47:51 AM
I may have alluded to this already but we made a few tweaks to the axle design a few months ago.  I changed the detail of the CV boot interface to match on each end.  I optomized the axle shaft sizing to minimize any potential stress risers (we haven't had any issues, but still, if I was tweaking the design I figured I might as well make the design as ideal as possible).

Finally, there's the silver zinc finish.  Looks awesome and will keep these looking great for a long long time.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0905Custom.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0906Custom.JPG)

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/8DSC_0909Custom.JPG)

Only downside was that I had to send our axle Vendor a CV bearing so they could check the splines with the finish applied.  Naturally I needed that, so my project took a step backward, to keep y'all rocking the best possible stuff.  Don't say we never did anything for you.

We're keeping these kits in stock and can get them out the door very quickly when you order.

-Joel (for the Ronin guys)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on February 26, 2013, 08:36:56 PM
I had a guy ask me this question today while talking about my car.  He asked what was the weak link in my setup, the diff or the axles.  I didn't really have an answer for him, but said it was probably the cv's.  It got me thinking though.  Is this something you guys have thought about, and if so what are your thoughts?  The discussion started after I mentioned a possible upgrade to attempt to run single digits next year.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 27, 2013, 01:20:19 PM
The honest answer is that we haven't had anyone break one yet to know.  I think Jax04 is making the most HP in a drag car running our rear that I can know of off hand but we have sold quite a few of these now and we have the kit pretty dialed in.  My impression is that with the T2 setup the order of weak links is typically:  stub axles, ring and pinion, inner CV, halfshaft, then finally outer CV.  There are exceptions in the order a few folks have broken things but in general we're removing the first 4 of those weak links.  Guys have gone 8s on the outer CVs (albeit with an auto), our halfshafts come with a lifetime warrantee from the manufacture (Break one and they'll replace it for us no questions asked.  Break another and we can get a refund but they'll want to know more about your setup).  The inner CVs are giant since they're intended for a much heaver vehicle...  etc.

Making a custom hub is an option that would let us upsize outer CVs and halfshaft diameter, but since we don't really know how the strength of the 8.8 ring and pinion in the explorer housing compare to the other parts I kind of want to see folks push it until one lets go.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on February 28, 2013, 12:31:28 AM
Well that makes sense, I seem to remember reading something similar a while back.  If you don't mind me asking, how many kits do you guys have out there now? 
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 28, 2013, 02:50:44 AM
PM sent.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on March 19, 2013, 10:50:45 AM
I'm getting pretty far down the road with my install. I haven't seen any good pre-weld pictures for the front mount on here. Mine didn't quite snug up to the subframe features. Doesn't look bad to me considering all the tolerances involved. I attache some pictures. Am I in the ballpark based on others experiences ?

Steve[attachimg=1][attachimg=2]
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 19, 2013, 11:53:17 AM
Steve,

The easiest and most guranteed way to verify the fit is to tack the final position with the diff mounted to the rear cradle in position under the car, the subframe raised, and the 12 mm bolt through the front mount.  Effectively, mock up the install.

In general yes you're in the ballpark. Mine was maybe .060" tighter but I did note that the indexing of the tie rod hole on the back could be improved.  I already made that change to mounts going forward.

There are some fairly wide tolerances in Mazda's lip around the subframe so if the trial mockup says you want the support point tucked tighter you can clearance it slightly if required.  I don't really want to cut that area of the mount any larger than we have now least it give us an unnecessarily large gap to fill.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on March 19, 2013, 12:14:43 PM
This fitup was done as you described with everything installed in the car. I clamped it instead of tacking because I don't have a welder. I'll take it to the shop accross the road and get it welded.

Thanks for the input. It is really pretty good considering the number of pieces and most of them weldments.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 19, 2013, 02:31:00 PM
Good to hear. It is a pretty weird shape to hit, but it sounds like you're there.  I approve of the extra markings to be sure the clamps didn't move.

Before you paint, you may wish to clearance the buldge for the tie rod mount shown in your top picture.  If you dent the convex bump aft of the tire rod welds but just in front of the landing surface for the new diff front mount it'll help keep the lower leading edge of the Ford front mount clear where the two parts get close.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on March 19, 2013, 03:55:09 PM
Thanks Joel. I will clearance that area. From the looks of it I have a pretty good gap there compared to some other pics I've seen on here.

Dropped the piece off at the weld shop on my lunch hour and Pat of Pat's Muffler and Welding called me back an hour later to say it was done  :). My driveshaft ships on Wednesday so after the paint I am ready for final assembly. The stupid late spring we are having makes me ahead of schedule. It's 20F with a foot of snow on the ground right now  :(

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on March 19, 2013, 08:56:42 PM
Steve, you are gonna love the diff. I want to thank you again for the idea on the LS3 air bridge too. My car gained 9hp/14lbft tq after it was retuned.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on March 23, 2013, 02:37:40 PM
Looking forward to proper gears for the car. The 4.10's are OK for the track but not great on the street.

I can't take any credit for the airbridge deal. It is a blatant theft of what Flyin Miata is doing with their V8 swap cars. I hope I get some of that HP too.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fc3sls3 on April 01, 2013, 08:37:48 PM
I guess I'll chime in with breaking 8.8 stuff. With this setup the two pieces that will most likely let go are the outer CVs (I have shattered one) and the aluminum explorer diff itself. Those housings are not the strongest piece, I would recommend figuring out a way to incorporate the rear cover that allows the use of bearing cap pre-load bolts.

DSS makes a outer Hub/CV upgrade kit. I am currently working with them to make it work in conjunction with the 8.8 swap.

One reason why you will still get some wheel hop (even with everything solid mounted) is the fact there will always be a harmonic difference between the two half shafts. Most OEM manufactures have now designed their IRS half shafts with two different thick half shaft bars. This helps eliminate the dreaded wheel hop.

 :chug:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on April 02, 2013, 01:00:24 PM
what's the biggest stumbling block for the moser cover? my buddy owns peformance plus in saskatoon and i was going to use one of those covers... 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 02, 2013, 03:16:03 PM
fc3sls3...  Pardon me for the obvious, but you are running the Ronin 8.8 yes?  We can't always track customer orders by name against folks' logins on here.  Assuming that's true and you broke an outer CV while running our kit can you please send us an email to roninspeedworks@gmail.com with full details of your setup:  (parts, power levels, tires, use etc) so we can better make recommendations to folks? 

I'd also be interested in chatting in regards to a few of the other claims made...  IE I know guys blow up Cobra housings/diff covers, but I'm not aware of explorer's having issues, and definitely not when using our mount that adds stiffness already.  Obviously any part has a limit but I'd rather have the discussion offline where you can point me to specifics if possible.

Thanks for taking the time to offer some feedback.  We always want to hear what customer's have to say.


mxman, no other covers have been validated against our kit since we were attempting to keep this as economical as possible for 99% of folks.  A lot of guys in the huge horsepower 1% end up going solid axle anyways.  The downside of a different cover is that if the placement of the ribs is different you may need to cut/clearance our mounting points and/or the cover.  How much work that takes and how smooth your cutting is will determine whether you end up with stress risers that could cause you issue down the road.  The explorer cover is already heavily ribbed and a great deal more stout than the most factory covers.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wayne on April 02, 2013, 03:21:05 PM
You will have a hard time breaking the DSS's outer cv. I have them in my car. 1.33 60ft's. Very nice pieces. I assume they are gonna be the same as what comes in their pro level axle kit. Wait till you see the difference from a stock TII outer! Monsters....

Breakage in my stock set up was always the axles shafts. Once i upgraded to the DSS bar upgrade, i broke outer cv's. I ended up with a pro level kit and now it wipes the ring gear teeth clean off. I never once broke a stub shaft. I have a surplus of those out in the garage..lol
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 02, 2013, 03:25:08 PM
Wayne, I'm still a bit bummed we didn't get to work with you as it was going to be my excuse to figure out the DSS outers for folks.  We're not planning to reinvent the wheel there but for the few who need more and who really wanted to stay IRS I'd have no issue sending folks to Frank. 

Still for what you're doing, I can't argue that the Fab 9 makes sense.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wayne on April 02, 2013, 07:05:33 PM
Wayne, I'm still a bit bummed we didn't get to work with you as it was going to be my excuse to figure out the DSS outers for folks.  We're not planning to reinvent the wheel there but for the few who need more and who really wanted to stay IRS I'd have no issue sending folks to Frank. 

Still for what you're doing, I can't argue that the Fab 9 makes sense.
I believe the options to upgrade your kit with DSS stuff would be to purchase a pro level kit for the rx7. Then have them modify the kit to include axle stubs from the mustang kit. There is still the issue with the seal area being different sizes on the stub shafts but frank did say in an email that he had some that fit explorer type rear ends.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on April 02, 2013, 11:35:33 PM
It likely has been covered in this 33 page thread, but I wanted to verify/clarify.  Has it indeed been confirmed first gen mx6/probe turbo axles will work for axle donors, as well as the 88-91 929?

This kit is likely overkill for my little 2.3 swap, but after breaking a stub shaft this weekend I have to do something.  I am having enough trouble locating t2 diff and halfshafts that I think I would be foolish to not simply spend a little more money on your kit, as it looks quite well done.  Finding a set of t2 halfshafts is the hardest part for me, and I honestly hate killing as set to do the conversion.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on April 03, 2013, 06:52:09 PM
I also did the swap from a n/a diff and had a hard time finding T2 outters.  I wound up getting in touch with Ricardo (rx7v8builder) and used the same outters he used.  They work perfectly and are not expensive.  I can't say how strong they are, but I've put almost 8k miles on the swap and I'm approaching 200 passes down the track, with 60 ft times in the high 1.50's and very low 1.60's.  At my power level the whole setup has been pretty solid.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on April 03, 2013, 06:54:14 PM
I can still get a hold of these CV joints if anyone should need a set.
PM me if interested.
I have been running them in my conversion for a while now with 400WHP

(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00125-20111018-1735.jpg)



These are the units I used.  They fit the hub perfectly, but require a different wheel seal.

Seal is National or Timken part# 710393.


On a side note, do you just need a replacement stub to let you enjoy your car until the upgrade?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on April 04, 2013, 09:25:03 PM




On a side note, do you just need a replacement stub to let you enjoy your car until the upgrade?

Thank you, but I do have a complete spare NA diff with halfshafts.  My original plan was run it until it breaks, but I thought that would take more than the first "angry" pass on slicks.  I may would be interested though as it would allow me to keep my spare "intact."  Would you take 45$ for it?  Is it possible to extract a broken stub without removing the diff if it is broken, or does that pretty much mean it has to come out?  I assume it has to come out from the inside unless I got really lucky, but I have never had one of these apart.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 04, 2013, 09:45:25 PM
Sorry to hear about the breakage.  Never fun, even when kinda expected.  If you pull the opposite side stub axle you may be able to drive out the broken stub with the diff in place.

FWIW an entire NA rear isn't worth much.  Even guys with the LSD version struggle selling them so I'd do some research on going rates on the club before you assume stealing parts from your spare is a bad idea.

Let us know how Ronin can help getting you setup with the new hotness, we do have diff kits in stock.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on April 04, 2013, 11:04:28 PM
Yeah you can pull the other side out and knock the broken piece out with a pipe and sledge hammer.  Joel is right about your stock n/a stuff, it doesn't keep it's value like the TII rear and axles.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on April 08, 2013, 07:03:08 PM
I've got some of The turbo Probe/MX6 outers on my car .
(I got the from Ricardo) I haven't  had a bit of trouble  .
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on April 08, 2013, 08:17:08 PM
Sorry to hear about the breakage.  Never fun, even when kinda expected.  If you pull the opposite side stub axle you may be able to drive out the broken stub with the diff in place.

FWIW an entire NA rear isn't worth much.  Even guys with the LSD version struggle selling them so I'd do some research on going rates on the club before you assume stealing parts from your spare is a bad idea.

Let us know how Ronin can help getting you setup with the new hotness, we do have diff kits in stock.

Don't worry, I didn't mean to insinuate I thought an NA lsd diff was a gold mine, simply I likely will not be able to swing your kit for a few months, and the more spares the merrier.

While I actually think it is quite reasonably priced for what you get, It is a hard sell to my significant other for my puny little turbo 4 banger car.  I am in the process of selling some items to free up some cash.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on April 10, 2013, 09:59:55 PM
Got mine on the road ! Well for 10 miles ahead of the snowstorm anyway. Really smooth and quiet and the gearing finally matches the rest of the drivetrain. I hope we actually get to summer and track season soon  ::). The installation was very straightforward.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: SbcJim on April 15, 2013, 10:50:20 PM
I am picking up my 8.8 IRS at the salvage yard tomorrow and most likely placing the order for the mounting kit...Awesome!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on April 19, 2013, 12:01:56 AM
You won't be disappointed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Rogue Status on April 27, 2013, 01:17:29 PM
Just pulled my diff at the yard. $85. Yes only $85 bucks!!!!!

Does anyone have a part number for the tulip bearings?  Thanks!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: tweak on May 21, 2013, 12:48:08 AM
I did this with a simple heads cam in my race FC, would this 8.8 upgrade solve this issue?

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 21, 2013, 01:56:01 PM
I did this with a simple heads cam in my race FC, would this 8.8 upgrade solve this issue?

Folks have run a great more power than a heads/cam car can make without issues to date.  I can't guaranteed you'll never break another part, but assuming you have the rear end set up properly I'd be surprised if you did.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on May 21, 2013, 02:46:53 PM
470 whp and everything is very happy. Lap times improved 3 seconds too with 3.73 gear.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on May 23, 2013, 11:48:06 PM
470 whp and everything is very happy. Lap times improved 3 seconds too with 3.73 gear.

That's impressive (and surprising, did it eliminate a few shifts?).

I have "commited" to this in my mind.  Already purchased the outer CV's, and next batch of ECU's I sell will pay for kit.  Looks very well done.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on May 28, 2013, 05:52:53 PM
I talked to the driveshaft shop last week, the guy said they offer a pro level kit for either the stock t2 housing for the fc, or a pro level kit for an 8.8 swap...they both are $2100 each, they both use a porsche shaft and you press a new bearing and outer hub into your stock bearing or it replaces the bearing..something to that effect...

he's pretty confident you shoudl never break one.. if i were thinking of buying this kit and i havent even opened the axle boot boxes or the taken the shafts out of the packaging, do you think you folks at ronin may take them back? minus a restocking obviously..
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on May 28, 2013, 06:19:16 PM
I've been itching to prove whether the DSS pro-level kit can work with our kit.  I know Frank has that for the Cobra 8.8 IRS and we heard through the grapevine that he has it for Explorer 8.8 IRS as well.  That said, Frank's pro-level axles are way more than my stroker motor needs so I won't be doing it myself. 

Mxman, if you or someone already bought a Ronin kit and wants to try Frank's axles, I'd waive our restocking fee entirely for the halfshafts/boots (assuming parts are uninstalled/mint) for the first customer who wants to do so just so we can figure out what's required.

If a new customer wants to try Frank's axles with our cradle we can also help you out.  We've sold a few cradles without axles and axles without cradles, just had to do custom pricing for folks.  I like having options, but the super beef cake axle setup has never been a priority to do ourselves because by the time you're making such big numbers to need the uber halfshafts most FC guys are building dedicated drag cars with solid axles.  Not much demand.  Still there may be a few guys it would help and we're here to serve.

-Joel
(for the Ronin guys)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on May 28, 2013, 06:28:58 PM
I haven't checked back in for awhile since I started running the Ronin 8.8. I've got about 700 miles on the swap now and I love the way the car drives with the 3.55 gears. I don't remember anyone mentioning it but one of the benefits is better mpg. I am getting about 3mpg better mileage driving back and forth to work.

We'll try the track next weekend. I'm looking forward to the 3 sec reduced laptimes Charlie promised above.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on May 29, 2013, 08:57:02 PM
I just did the DSS conversion on ZDan's FD but did only the Porsche inners to replace the sloppy Cobra inners. They were able to do that for me for way less than the full meal deal of 2100.00. I sent them Dan's axles that were already setup for the Cobra diff and they did the Porsche inners for less than 700.00. Good stuff.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on June 04, 2013, 12:25:35 PM
Track report:

I took the RX7 with Ronin rear diff kit to the track on Sunday. It was my first time out with the new rear but I've done about 20 track days with the car. It's a typical LS1/T56 FC with big brakes, coilovers, Conti Grand Am Cup take off tires and around 400 whp. It has a full interior and gets driven on the street alot, including to and from the track.

My home track is Brainerd Intl in Minnesota. We were using the 2.5 mi competition course. I spent a fair amount of time with a gearing calculator when I chose the 3.55's with this track in mind. My max speed was 125, min was about 40 and average of 80 (love the new Harry's laptmer for iPhone app my spec miata friend turned me on to.) I don't have any comparison times because the track was repaved and widened since last year.

With the 4.10 gears I was shifting 10 times per lap. I couldn't belive it was that many, counted three times. There are several places where I had to shift up to 4th and back to 3rd in a fairly short distance. I had to use 5th at the fastest part of the track. With the 3.55's I shift FOUR times per lap. I mostly leave it in 3rd and just drive. I go to second for the slowest corner and 4th at the fast part. It is great skipping all the shifter monkey motion. More fun and I'm sure faster too.

Highly recommended  8)

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on June 17, 2013, 10:36:06 AM
Does anyone have any "good" measurements on total driveshaft length relative to their previous setup with a stock NA diff?  I am going to buy the kit soon, and would like to have a driveshaft on hand so i can do the swap in a single day (instead of test fitment/measure, then have a shaft made). 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on June 27, 2013, 07:03:41 PM
check out this one joel etc

http://www.lpwracing.com/Ultra_FORD/Ultra_FORD.html (http://www.lpwracing.com/Ultra_FORD/Ultra_FORD.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on June 27, 2013, 09:30:31 PM
Does anyone have any "good" measurements on total driveshaft length relative to their previous setup with a stock NA diff?  I am going to buy the kit soon, and would like to have a driveshaft on hand so i can do the swap in a single day (instead of test fitment/measure, then have a shaft made). 


The answer to your question is "it depends". What engine mount kit are you using? What front yoke are you planning on using?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on June 28, 2013, 03:18:05 PM
Wow, the bracket really fits on the 8.8 well, I might try one of those aftermarket covers so i can get some protection of the caps...
I raised it up into the car... pretty exciting.

I got a 2002 explorer diff and got a double flanged shaft with the slip yoke...cool oem part..  guess it's full custom for me!

Any recommendations of rpm i should get it balanced to?  i do'nt know how fast i'll drive the car but you never know... a guy gets stupid when he is on a straight stretch of road sometimes ! ;) COUGH, er...track! TRACK!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 01, 2013, 02:17:26 PM
I think most driveshaft shops have standards they balance things too, but if you have to specify a number I'd just balance it to whatever rpm your gear ratios and tires works out to at your predicted top speed plus a bit for margin (20 mph?)

Balanced is balanced and should be irrespective of RPM but we all know that these things have tolerances and tiny imperfections become a great deal more noticable when you're up at top speed.  If your driveshaft shop only knows passenger cars and rock crawlers you might need a different shop.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 02, 2013, 10:56:26 AM
A tip on balancing - Ask them to use low profile weights on the driveshaft. My weights come very close to the subframe, but the weights are pretty thick.

You can see the weight here at the 8 oclock position.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2240.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on July 02, 2013, 03:45:47 PM
Hey Ash,

Is that a 3 or 3.5" diameter driveshaft in the above picture?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 03, 2013, 07:22:56 PM
Good point Joel. Mine is a 3.5 inch, so this will not be an issue for the guys running 3 inch shafts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on July 09, 2013, 01:23:31 PM
I just talked to Tad at driveshaft shop, he said they offer a stub axle conversion for the explorer, or cobra diff that allows you to run the pro level axles..if this is the case, this is F'ng awesome news.   $2100 or something...

I am going to try to compile the specs on my setup after finishing it.

remember everybody, at least with my MMR mounts the diff can/will move on the spindles, i believe my diff was a bit further back on the holes and when i pried it all the way forward my mount bolt no longer fits through... so keep this in mind, before you weld get the diff fore and aft where you want it!

Also, Just called moser, the Py088 pinion yoke (w/ straps) that ricardo is using is 3 7/8" on the long side, so, it shoudl be more than enough to accomodate 1350 ujoints after some cutting.  The stock cobra/exploder pinion flange is around 5 3/16th" in diameter... should be a good upgrade  apparently companion flanges are not good for 1000 hp applications(not that most of us care.)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on July 13, 2013, 10:05:07 PM
Does anyone have any "good" measurements on total driveshaft length relative to their previous setup with a stock NA diff?  I am going to buy the kit soon, and would like to have a driveshaft on hand so i can do the swap in a single day (instead of test fitment/measure, then have a shaft made). 


The answer to your question is "it depends". What engine mount kit are you using? What front yoke are you planning on using?

Perhaps I was not clear in my question.  Where will the pinion flange be of the explorer differential, relative to the previous location of a stock NA pinion flange?  This, plus my existing driveshaft would tell me what I need to know to have my new driveshaft made.   I would be willing to bet I am the only person on this forum running my goofy, non sensical engine setup (2.3 ford turbo, t5 transmission).  It has been running reliably for 2 years, but as soon as slicks went on stub shaft went boom.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on July 25, 2013, 04:00:22 PM
it depends, if you want to run a 1350 non companion flange setup you'll need the py088  1350 yoke from moser...  if you run 1310 or 1330 you'll probably be fine but... the big pattern 1350 flange that comes on the exploder is 5 1/64? and the moser is like 3 7/8" wide... it's a lot roomier!  ;)

$180 or something, dirty cheap! :)

I seriously don't know how anybody could just use somebody elses driveshaft lengths unless every car was the same ,every kit was teh same etc... just get the kit mount it and then measure ! it's the only way really..


BTW  Joel http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland-Empire/537/SY-727-1350Q/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland-Empire/537/SY-727-1350Q/10002/-1)    This yoke should work for all the  viperized transmissions, there is another one for $26x from anothe mark williams.

Inland empire spins the shafts to 3500 rpm and i'm getting a 3" dom steel shaft made by them and they're including the yoke for me for around $580 or something.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: SEDUCE on August 01, 2013, 08:25:06 AM
Hey guys, i am about to do the swap on my FC with a Cobra 8.8" but with a Tbird cover and i want to install a full spool. Can anyone tell me what brand or who does one ?
I will use the DSS pro level shafts so i can get the splines done to suit what diff i use.
Can anyone help me out here?
Thanks
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on August 01, 2013, 08:00:35 PM
So, you are about to do a swap that has almost nothing to do with the purpose of this thread....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 01, 2013, 11:11:07 PM
Hey guys, i am about to do the swap on my FC with a Cobra 8.8" but with a Tbird cover and i want to install a full spool. Can anyone tell me what brand or who does one ?
I will use the DSS pro level shafts so i can get the splines done to suit what diff i use.
Can anyone help me out here?
Thanks

Buy a mini spool or buy a full spool and have it machined for the halfshaft circlips
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on August 02, 2013, 12:50:45 PM
so, i ordered a 3.5" 1350 yoked aluminum shaft from inland empire (in ontario CA) i told him you guys potentially could send him some business being you're nearby...

anyways, the moser py088 pinion yoke accepts 1350s and is 3 7/8 across the wide way... the big pattern expolder is 5 1/64  IIRC

the 3.5" shaft should fit with some chopping... I took some paper and rolled it up in a 3.5" tube and checked it over..

Inland Empire balanced the driveshaft to a critical speed well over 10k (10k registers only at 48 inches, this 35 7/16? shaft should be good for 14k or something retarded)   their balancing machine is good for 3500 rpm no weights were needed he just machined the yokes down a bit and rebalanced it

inland said that my driveshaft is just over 4 inches measured diagonally across the yoke

as far as the front yoke i'm  a viper  setup,  inland manufactures 2 piece yokes and  has a viper yoke and also a t56 2 piece yoke...

:)


Oh, and... I have called a few manufacturers about their diff covers with bolt girdles for the bearing caps...  this one seems to be the thinnest and may fit quite easily..

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/gta-40-2013-1-al (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/gta-40-2013-1-al)

it's .56" thick aka 9/16ths  i might grab one and check it out
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 02, 2013, 01:22:19 PM
You will need to get a diff cover that does not have webbing on the flange or at least minimal webbing. The clearancing needed for that cover cover may compromise the mount but I would check with Joel to get his thoughts.

See the diff mount on the Explorer cover below.

This TA cover might make your life easier.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003T1PO0S (http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003T1PO0S)

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0254.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on August 16, 2013, 11:48:13 AM
TA makes 50-100% of all of the covers, i got hte ford one which is the same as this one...  if it doesn't work perfectly i'll prolly just sell er... :)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on August 22, 2013, 02:48:21 PM
What are you folks seeing as the going rates for the donor 8.8 diffs and inner CV's?  Getting ready to order the Ronin kit, but having a hard time tracking the stuff down locally.  Got a quote for 3.73 LSD with inner CV's for $495 shipped.  Sound reasonable, or too high?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on August 22, 2013, 03:21:25 PM
thats not bad. Im having a hard time finding the inner tulips.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on August 23, 2013, 10:45:01 AM
I bought a rear and axles from a yard for about $230. Ended up completely rebuiling it though. As stated earlier in this thread, lots of the used rears suffer from poor assembly from the factory.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on August 24, 2013, 08:28:39 AM
I bought a rear and axles from a yard for about $230. Ended up completely rebuiling it though. As stated earlier in this thread, lots of the used rears suffer from poor assembly from the factory.

Same thing I have experienced. Seems like the going rate around Atl is 400. w/axles and I still go through them.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 25, 2013, 01:54:01 PM
I spent 200 shipped for my diff (open diff 3.73) and 50 shipped for 2 axles. I went through the whole rear end as well.

Ford Racing 8.8 rebuild kit is $79 shipped. It comes with everything but the outer stub axle seals which are rarely bad.

Cobra spec Trac Lok rebuild kit is $119 shipped

A brand new Cobra spec 31 spline Trac Lok LSD is $219 shipped.

They also have new Ford gear sets for $139 shipped

buyfordracing.com
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on September 03, 2013, 12:18:55 PM
I got my kit this week, and hope to get it installed in the next week or two (killed my second stub axle this weekend, with a 4 cylinder and streets tires, those things are impressively week).

What are most of you guys running for mounts/bushings?  At the least I need the side/outboard/rear bushings.  Delrin is cheap on ebay, but I question fitment (and notice they don't come with metal sleeves).  Rubber/Competition mounts from Mazdatrix?

Also, on the front mount are most people just using the rubber bushings already in explorer diff?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on September 03, 2013, 02:28:49 PM
Yes, Mazdacomp at the rear and the Ford front.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on September 03, 2013, 05:37:15 PM
Ok fellows... i'm just going to reiterate what they've said..  lol..try to stay away from the 3.5" aluminum driveshaft hahahha... mine is installed but i had to cut A LOT of metal out and had to reinforce the subframe ...it may fold up still...hahaha...plus the driveshaft loop was a real bitch to modify to fit...   

I put a pinion snubber in though for the lols...  eff wheelhop!

:)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on September 04, 2013, 07:07:39 PM
Mazda comp mounts here and the stock ford mount up front.  I don't know if a spacer is included in the kit to go between the front diff mount and subframe, but I used the stock Ford rubber bushing there as well.  No solid mounts anywhere.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on September 05, 2013, 08:58:18 AM
Mazda comp mounts here and the stock ford mount up front.  I don't know if a spacer is included in the kit to go between the front diff mount and subframe, but I used the stock Ford rubber bushing there as well.  No solid mounts anywhere.

They include a few rubber washers now.

Reading through this thread, it appears unless you go with a u-bolt/2 piece transmission yoke, the driveshaft has to go up with the subframe.  I did buy the strange 3150 pinion yoke.  Does this help with this or not?  I have looked for a 2 piece transmission yoke to fit my t5, but have not been able to find one.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 05, 2013, 10:14:53 AM
Mazda comp mounts here and the stock ford mount up front.  I don't know if a spacer is included in the kit to go between the front diff mount and subframe, but I used the stock Ford rubber bushing there as well.  No solid mounts anywhere.

They include a few rubber washers now.

Reading through this thread, it appears unless you go with a u-bolt/2 piece transmission yoke, the driveshaft has to go up with the subframe.  I did buy the strange 3150 pinion yoke.  Does this help with this or not?  I have looked for a 2 piece transmission yoke to fit my t5, but have not been able to find one.

No it won't help because the subframe will be in the way.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on September 05, 2013, 02:35:57 PM
Kinda what I assumed.  I was hoping since the overall assembly would be slightly shorter/smaller and further forward it may have a prayer.

I guess that really isn't that big of a deal.  My car has been together 4 years and the DS has only been down 1x for a clutch change.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 05, 2013, 04:34:51 PM
...
Reading through this thread, it appears unless you go with a u-bolt/2 piece transmission yoke, the driveshaft has to go up with the subframe.  I did buy the strange 3150 pinion yoke.  Does this help with this or not?  I have looked for a 2 piece transmission yoke to fit my t5, but have not been able to find one.

Little help for your hunt...

I believe the t5 output is the same 27 spline output that the t56 uses.  That means the recommendations in the install instructions hold...  For 1310 u-joints, I suggest a c3 corvette type yoke (even the OEMs were two piece):
- http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p9_corvette_transmission_slip_yoke_1310_series_u_bolt_style_27_.html (http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p9_corvette_transmission_slip_yoke_1310_series_u_bolt_style_27_.html)

1350 series slip yoke has two known options, unfortunately the more common/cheaper choices aren’t the two piece variety we need.
-Strange U1677   http://www.strangeengineering.net/catalog/134.html (http://www.strangeengineering.net/catalog/134.html)
-Mark Williams 39105   http://www.markwilliams.com/detail.aspx?ID=329 (http://www.markwilliams.com/detail.aspx?ID=329)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on September 06, 2013, 07:53:26 AM
While I truly appreciate the help, I am 99% sure the Ford t5 is 28 spline.  I had that c3 vette yoke in my "cart" before I checked that a few days ago.

One more reason I should have went ls/t56 like a normal person.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 06, 2013, 12:59:57 PM
While I truly appreciate the help, I am 99% sure the Ford t5 is 28 spline.  I had that c3 vette yoke in my "cart" before I checked that a few days ago.

One more reason I should have went ls/t56 like a normal person.

Yea you are right the Ford T-5 has a 28 spline output. It is the only oddball I believe. All the rest of the Ford 5 speed variants Tremec T45, TKO 500/600, 3650, and even the c6 auto use the 31 spline output, as does the Ford spec T56.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Smith18 on September 30, 2013, 01:17:02 AM
Hey guys got some good miles on my ronin 8.8 setup. Overall the setup seems to be working great other than the stock 626 mazda outers. Ive already snapped two, one with drag radials on the street launching at 2500, other time was today at the track with slicks launching at the same rpm. Both snapped at the same spot(right where the outer cv joint splines start to go into the wheel hub, last time it took the bearing and hub).

Just wondering if anyone else has done some real drag racing with this setup yet? and whats the answer for these dam outers? or what the hell am i doing wrong. Bought this kit as i couldn't find any T2's and i blew up 4 n/a diffs already, thought this was the answer. Alittle frustrated....


My car is nothing special at all, roughly 380rwhp ls1/t56 FC. 26x11.5 mt streets.... 275/40-17 nitto 555's.... mmr subframe, mmr rear diff mounts, stock front mount, mmr dtss eliminators, all other bushings stock. KYB 8 way adjustable struts, stock springs.

Thanks.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on September 30, 2013, 08:49:26 AM
DSS has an upgrade setup for the outers, but it's not cheap.   Uses Porsche parts if memory serves.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: GuillaumeC on September 30, 2013, 09:46:22 AM
Are the T2 outer joints considerably stronger than the 626 outers you're using?

I have to decide what I'll do with the rear end before installing the turbo LT1 and I really liked this 8.8 swap. I'll have to do something about the outer CV joints if they wont support the added load from the new motor.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on September 30, 2013, 10:30:47 AM
where are you getting these 626 outers?  if they are cheap chinese axle parts from an auto parts store that is probably the issue.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Smith18 on September 30, 2013, 12:02:45 PM
Ya there A1 cardone 626 outers.  So get some t2 outers and I should be good? Has anyone been down the drag strip with this kit with slicks?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mxman on September 30, 2013, 12:12:59 PM
I was thinking the same thing...aren't most of the t2  axles breaking the outer cv ball bearing cage? not the spline off of the axle Mmmm he's snapping the spline right off the outer...lol !
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 30, 2013, 12:23:55 PM
Since it's the splines of the outer CV failing I'm guessing it's the quality of the CV itself.   The first thing I'd recommend you try would be contacting Ricardo (v8rx7builder) about getting hands on the GKN outer CVs.  For T2 axles generally it's a private party deal so your best bet is rx7club classifieds.

Were you getting any wheel hop?  If so you'll want to go through the rest of your setup point by point and be sure nothing is sloppy.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on September 30, 2013, 12:26:47 PM
you can get used 88-92 or whatever 929 axles from car-part.com that would be factory parts for pretty cheap.  that is what i did.  i havent run mine down the strip yet so i cant tell you how they will hold up there.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Smith18 on October 01, 2013, 12:20:24 PM
What are you guys torquing your axle nuts to with these 626 outers?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on October 02, 2013, 07:02:36 PM
What are your 60 ft times?  I've got literally hundreds of passes on my setup now averaging 1.60-1.62, with a best of 1.58, and the only problem I've had is the bottom washer of the mount bolt deforming (solved by doubling them up and been ok for a year now).  I'm using the GKN outers that Ricardo sourced for me, but I can't say whether or not they are better than the 626 units.  One thing to note though is that my car generally doesn't experience any wheel hop and even though the 60 ft times are decent it doesn't jump off the line hard like maybe your manual trans setup would.

Got any vids of you launching?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 02, 2013, 07:10:52 PM
I've got literally hundreds of passes on my setup now averaging 1.60-1.62, with a best of 1.58, and the only problem I've had is the bottom washer deforming (solved by doubling them up and been ok for a year now). 

FYI We've included an extra washer in all kits sold since you told us this.   Thanks for the valdiation on the GKN outers.  I'm going to be running those myself.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on October 02, 2013, 08:14:37 PM
Ahhhh, well there you go, no problem then.  Glad I was able to contribute something.  I'm sure with all the feedback the kit is probably dialed in pretty good by now.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Smith18 on October 02, 2013, 08:25:16 PM
honestly with my drag radials i couldnt launch the car really at all without wheel hop!. Stock n/a diff i could basically dump the clutch from an idle and pull a 1.95 60ft(spinning through first) with no wheel hop. This kit it wheel hops no matter what i do, i have to play with the throttle from a launch so it doesnt wheel hop, and usually at the top of first it ends up wheel hopping right at around 5500-6200 before i shift into second. I also added mmr subframe, mmr rear diff mount bushings, and mmr dtss eliminators when i installed this kit.

Then i installed my slicks and took it out on the streets, i could launch it all the way up to 4500rpm and dump the clutch and fucking GO!. but was spinning, wasnt a dead hook like at the track this sunday when i snapped an outer launching at 3000rpm.

Is it just the sudden hit of the standard transmission. Auto's are totally different.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on October 03, 2013, 11:49:33 AM
great. I have the cardone outers.....guess i'll hold onto my T2 axles for now...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 03, 2013, 12:51:41 PM
Hey Smith, please shoot me an email at roninspeedworks@gmail.com

Walk me through as much of your setup as you can and we'll see if we can get it figured out.  Generally we've found this to be far less prone to wheel hop but since wheel hop behaves a little like a harmonic vibration different setups may behave differently.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on October 03, 2013, 02:33:15 PM
i havent spun my tires much yet, and only from a roll the little bit i have, but i have zero wheel hop.


mmr subrframe and diff mounts
mmr dtss/rear steer eliminators
mmr spherical front control arm bushings
adjustable style latteral links with tie rod ends
koni yellow shocks
ground control coil overs


*i also replaced the other 2 hub mount points besides the dtss one with solid aluminum bushings
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on October 07, 2013, 10:45:34 AM
Can anyone tell me how much closer the ford rear end is to the tank compared to the T2?  I am curious if it will clear my fuel cell.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 07, 2013, 12:38:51 PM
Can anyone tell me how much closer the ford rear end is to the tank compared to the T2?  I am curious if it will clear my fuel cell.

Ballparking from memory but I believe we're clear of the factory tank's heat shield by about 3/8".  With the 8.8 you can still run a factory rear sway bar but only just.  I never took exact measurements of the T2 rear cover clearance but the halfshaft position is almost identical (we did that on purpose).  Assuming the cases/covers are similar that implies we should be 0.4" bigger because of the ring gear.  Does that give you enough comparison to go by?  I can try to get a picture for you if needed.  How tight is your fuel cell to the T2 rear now? 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on October 07, 2013, 06:48:55 PM
I have about 2-2.5" from the back of the cover to the fuel cell.  It sounds like it should fit.  I will measure the 8.8 when I pull it from the local boneyard.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 07, 2013, 06:55:40 PM
Let me know if you need me to measure this. I can on Friday if you still need an answer.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on October 07, 2013, 06:58:37 PM
Can anyone tell me how much closer the ford rear end is to the tank compared to the T2?  I am curious if it will clear my fuel cell.

Ballparking from memory but I believe we're clear of the factory tank's heat shield by about 3/8".  With the 8.8 you can still run a factory rear sway bar but only just.  I never took exact measurements of the T2 rear cover clearance but the halfshaft position is almost identical (we did that on purpose).  Assuming the cases/covers are similar that implies we should be 0.4" bigger because of the ring gear.  Does that give you enough comparison to go by?  I can try to get a picture for you if needed.  How tight is your fuel cell to the T2 rear now? 

i have closer to 3/4" from the farthest back point of the diff cover to the farthest forward point of the heat shield. (the heat shield is ribbed)

i was just under the car looking at this seconds ago
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on October 08, 2013, 12:20:49 AM
I am pretty confident it would fit, but for anyone having free time to measure I would greatly appreciate it.

I found this also, Ford T5 28 spline quick disconnect trans yoke

Inland Empire SY-C4-1350Q

http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland+Empire/537/SY-C4-1350Q/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland+Empire/537/SY-C4-1350Q/10002/-1)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on October 08, 2013, 10:20:07 AM
I do not have before and after measurements, but there is 1 3/8" clearance in my Ronin 8.8 conversion. (3/8" in front of the shield and 1" behind the gas tank heat shield)
This is measured from the seam of the gas tank halves to the upper rib on the Ring gear protrusion on the cover. If someone else can measure the clearance for the TII rear to the gas tank halves we can figure this out.
 
(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/IMG00122-20111011-1756.jpg) (http://s270.photobucket.com/user/reguzmans/media/RX7/IMG00122-20111011-1756.jpg.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on October 11, 2013, 12:42:23 PM
I pulled a 8.8 out of a 05 mountaineer this morning, as well as a 411 ecu from a silverado, $137 out the door.  Its time to start gathering parts.  Do you guys normally keep a mount kit in stock?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 11, 2013, 01:31:31 PM
I pulled a 8.8 out of a 05 mountaineer this morning, as well as a 411 ecu from a silverado, $137 out the door.  Its time to start gathering parts.  Do you guys normally keep a mount kit in stock?

Oh boy!!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on October 13, 2013, 11:33:20 PM
I am pretty confident it would fit, but for anyone having free time to measure I would greatly appreciate it.

I found this also, Ford T5 28 spline quick disconnect trans yoke

Inland Empire SY-C4-1350Q

http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland+Empire/537/SY-C4-1350Q/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland+Empire/537/SY-C4-1350Q/10002/-1)

^^^This should help WES KISER
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 14, 2013, 08:18:26 PM
I pulled a 8.8 out of a 05 mountaineer this morning, as well as a 411 ecu from a silverado, $137 out the door.  Its time to start gathering parts.  Do you guys normally keep a mount kit in stock?

Yes, we have several kits in stock.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 18, 2013, 10:37:23 PM
Well my kit is on the road finally. It is performing great so far! No wheelhop, no excessive noise and the taller gears are great!!

I have some preliminary diff temp info to report.. With some "assertive" driving today in 85 degree weather diff temps only got up to 165-170F, which is great... This is a lot cooler than I had first anticipated. I will have some track temp data after Nov 9.

My setup is :

3.73s, Detroit TruTrac, solid rear diff bushings, and a solid front mount setup.

There is some extra gear whine with the solid mount setup , but it is not bad at all, especially considering I have no interior in the car.

I also wanted to share my diff catch can setup. It is a go kart catch can I got off Amazon for around $20 shipped. I installed a sintered bronze breather on top, and drilled a hole in the floor and ran my hose to the brass barb I have on the diff. I needed a molded 90 degree hose to fit between the diff and the fuel tank heatsheild, but it came out nice.

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/FAFE8B0C-9E19-4C46-A8C5-7B863BA62052-19189-000012A8D6BE3313_zpsf4d630ef.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wickedrx7 on October 18, 2013, 10:53:40 PM
Pardon my ignorance, what is the purpose of the breather?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 19, 2013, 12:55:35 AM
Pardon my ignorance, what is the purpose of the breather?

All diffs have a breather somewhere so they don't build pressure internally when they get hot. Positive pressure could cause leakage at the seals. I have the remote catch can to catch and drain back any gear oil that leaves the carrier during track conditions.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on October 22, 2013, 10:30:13 PM
I am pretty confident it would fit, but for anyone having free time to measure I would greatly appreciate it.

I found this also, Ford T5 28 spline quick disconnect trans yoke

Inland Empire SY-C4-1350Q

http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland+Empire/537/SY-C4-1350Q/10002/-1 (http://www.jegs.com/i/Inland+Empire/537/SY-C4-1350Q/10002/-1)

^^^This should help WES KISER

Yes it should have, but unfortunately I saw it the day after my driveshaft was made. 

I hope to be driving mine in the next day or two.  I was pretty happy my strange 3150 yoke cleared my subframe with just clearancing with hammer (did not have to cut/notch subframe).  In hindsight I wish I would have just got a 3110 u bolt yoke, but its in now. 

I have set a track date for Nov 9th to run eighth mile.  I can now say with confidence that while my little junk 2.3t may break something, that something will not be from the tailshaft to the tires.

This kit is very well done, and went in easy.  While it is taking me weeks to finish with kids and schedule, I think the average guy could honestly do it in two 6 hour Saturdays if no unexpected parts were needed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 28, 2013, 01:37:02 PM
More diff temp info.. On a relatively warm day (low 80s) on a highway run with the car fully heatsoaked, my diff temps top out at about 185 F. That is about the highest I have seen so far. I will probably do a run through a local mountain road later this week and see what happens.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on October 29, 2013, 04:09:44 PM
I drove mine for the first time last night, and have about 50 uneventful miles on it thus far.

Nothing of significance to report, although the taller gear (3.73) changes the cars personality more than I would have guessed.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on October 29, 2013, 08:39:25 PM
Congrats on the maiden voyage.   :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on November 04, 2013, 08:21:09 AM
Anybody have any magic tricks for getting an axle out?  I have a seal leaking (likely self inflicted, forgot to clean/dress axles)?

I know the ford dealer uses a pair of wicked looking special pry bars. So far I have been unable to locate pry bars "special" enough. Online tutorials I have found show beating with wooded plank from other side, but the mounting bracket gets in the way of that.

Generally with this style axle I have had good luck with a slide hammer and chain, but I am having trouble getting these using that method.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on November 04, 2013, 09:00:23 AM
I like to set a pry bar behind the stub, leverage it against something then pop it with a deadblow.   That's about the same as a slide hammer in effect though.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 04, 2013, 12:45:21 PM
I like to set a pry bar behind the stub, leverage it against something then pop it with a deadblow.   That's about the same as a slide hammer in effect though.

Word. That's pretty much what I have done in the past. I have not have to remove the axles from the RX7 yet though.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on November 04, 2013, 02:35:33 PM
These explorer axles seam tougher than the ones I have done in the past.  Got some better pry bars from a guy at work, at whacking with the hammer just breaks the wood I am prying against.

I am going to buy some smaller chain tonight for the slide hammer so I can get it behind the stub, and double it up so I can pull straight.  I am afraid I need to weld the car to the jackstands first........
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on November 04, 2013, 03:32:53 PM
Make sure you rotate the axles occasionally as it may help get the blind circ clip to a happy spot. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on November 04, 2013, 06:37:10 PM
There is a TSB for leaking axle seals.

The newer Explorer rears (05 and up?) used a better seal design that was less prone to leaking.

http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1520299 (http://www.explorerforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1520299)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 04, 2013, 08:06:49 PM
And remember to knock off the seal protectors on the inner CVs if you upgrade to the new seals.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on November 04, 2013, 10:40:23 PM
And remember to knock off the seal protectors on the inner CVs if you upgrade to the new seals.

I am pretty sure that is why mine was leaking.  My donor CV already had the seal protector removed, but my housing had the old style seals.  The new seals (I bought Ford$ because they were only ones with it in stock on a Saturday) had VERY clear instructions about that.  On the other side the axle had the protector still on.

I tried a large selection of pry bars, and the slid hammer for a long time, and it did not budge.  I finally wound up cutting a small chamfer on a 1/2" AL plate I had lying around, and drove it between the axle and the housing with my largest hammer.  Popped out in 3 whacks.  I had 6 hours in pry bars and slide hammers.  I even borrowed a coworker's (who is a former over the road truck driveline mechanic) entire set of specialty pry bars.  For anyone with this kit, I would definitely recommend a 1/2" brass or AL plate wedge to remove axles.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on November 07, 2013, 08:51:31 AM
After completing the installation and putting some miles on the car, I must say I am very pleased.

The build quality was outstanding, everything fit great, and the documentation was much more complete than is typical for similar parts.

Planning a test n tune on Saturday, and am fairly confident that it will still propel itself afterward (has never happended, car has not made a single complete pass in 3 attempts).
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on November 10, 2013, 01:33:31 PM
Made 3 passes, and car is not broken. 
Best one was 7.99.  @91 with a 1.72 sixty foot.  I shifted really slow(brain dead I guess), and need a little more launch rpm.  With a 4800 rpm launch it bogged to 3000 on the drop.

Best money I have spent on car.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 12, 2013, 12:44:43 PM
More diff temp info -

On track the diff only got up to about 220F. Ambient was about 80F. This was not on R compounds or anything, but is pretty encouraging so far :)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on November 12, 2013, 06:29:46 PM
is this with a cooler?  i cant remember if you have one or not.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 13, 2013, 12:50:23 AM
Nope, no cooler.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on November 13, 2013, 08:28:54 PM
Ordered the kit 5 min ago as well as my true-trac!!!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 13, 2013, 11:17:01 PM
Congrats.. I cant wait to hear what you think of the Truetrac. I love it even more in this car than I did in my previous Mustang Cobra.

My car was great on corner exit at Auto Club Speedway. I still can't believe how much traction I got out of my worn out, 4 year old 235 NT05s.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on November 30, 2013, 04:39:10 PM
Anyone know what year mustang pinion flange fits the exploder housing?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on November 30, 2013, 06:08:24 PM
nevermind. Im stupid  ::) Ford 8.8, small pattern pinion flange is Ford OEM part number is E9SZ4851A   thanks Joel haha.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on November 30, 2013, 06:41:26 PM
Ok. Another question. Does the smaller mustang flange require additional subframe clearance? what about using the 1310 pinion yoke?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: V8-rx7 on December 01, 2013, 12:41:49 AM
Only running a 1350 U joint requires clearancing of the subframe.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on December 01, 2013, 10:12:16 AM
thank you sir!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on December 27, 2013, 01:02:14 AM
Just a heads up, OS Giken announced recently that they're going to be releasing an LSD for the Ford 8.8" in in "early 2014" which is pretty sweet.

I'm not really all too familiar with Ford LSD options, but OS Gikens are pretty much the cream of the crop anywhere...

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153430353745198&set=a.10153425521335198.1073741831.217131310197&type=1 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153430353745198&set=a.10153425521335198.1073741831.217131310197&type=1)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 27, 2013, 10:47:41 PM
Just a heads up, OS Giken announced recently that they're going to be releasing an LSD for the Ford 8.8" in in "early 2014" which is pretty sweet.

I'm not really all too familiar with Ford LSD options, but OS Gikens are pretty much the cream of the crop anywhere...

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153430353745198&set=a.10153425521335198.1073741831.217131310197&type=1 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153430353745198&set=a.10153425521335198.1073741831.217131310197&type=1)

Pretty much every type of differential option in existence is available for the 8.8. The OS Giken stuff is good, but I would say there are as high or even higher quality options available for the 8.8. That said it will be nice to have another option though! This is a nice step up from the Trac Lok LSDs that come standard in the Fords.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 29, 2013, 11:01:44 PM
Just wanted to throw in a comment about my recent experience as a precaution to the hardcore roadcourse guys. This is not a problem with the Ronin kit at all, just an extra step you might want to consider if you plan on heavily open tracking your car.

I just got back from a track day and found my driver side outer CV boot has "vented" from the band clamp on the stub axle and expelled some grease onto the hub area, brake caliper and inside of the rear wheel.

An easy indication that this is happening is seeing grease or oil spatter on the inside of your wheel.

This can happen because of excess heat associated with HPDE or open track racing. When I say excess heat, I mean rear brake rotor temps above 450F when coming off the track. To quantify this, I'm running DOT R compound tires, race brake pads, and driving the car hard. You wont see these heat levels on a car with street tires and brakes.

When I built my halfshafts I used the black CV grease that came with the boots. This grease is probably fine for 95% of us. If you plan do drive your car in extreme anger, often, for extended periods of time I suggest ditching the standard CV grease for some synthetic or other higher quality grease, at least for the outer CVs. Also be cognizant not to overfill the CV with an extreme amount of grease. 

My first attempt to solve this problem will be to clean out and repack both my outer CVs with better grease. I will use fresh CV band clamps and make sure they are as tight as possible

Neo HPCC #1 is an excellent CV/bearing grease used by Nascar, F1, Indycar and ALMS teams, but it is $70 for a pound. I don't think I need grease that nice. I am going to try the Neo CV500 grease that is half the price. It is probably good enough for my needs.

There is also the Redline synthetic grease which is $12.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on December 30, 2013, 12:26:50 PM
Ash,

I suspect the expansion of high temp air inside the boot is what built pressure and it's unlikely you were actually having the grease break down.  If you're doing it already, a high quality synthetic can't hurt but I'd also cut and clamp a tiny straw under the boot clamp at the narrow end (a 1" chunk form the tip of a can of WD-40 or compressed air is about right.)  It lets the boot "breathe" as it were and since it's tucked next to the shaft the grease shouldn't be in there all the time.  Little trick I picked up from the Carroll Smith books.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 30, 2013, 01:05:27 PM
Joel,

Agreed. The hot air in the boot is/was the source of my problem. The exiled grease does not seem as thick as what I remember putting in, but I will know for sure when I open up the outer CV.

Excellent tip on the boot venting. I was trying to think of a good way to accomplish that. I was going to prick a hole in the boot, but the straw idea is better. The boots you provide with the kit are adequate and pliable enough, so no issue with the hard parts of the kit.

My thinking on the grease is just for longevity. Some research last night found that some cars (albeit much heavier) can break down the grease in the outer CVs under extreme use. Gen 5 Camaros seem notorious for this, and other OEM race cars seem to have problems with this as well.

DSS offers a service they use on world challenge race cars. They pull the CV apart, polish everything, install heavy duty pliable boots and pack the CV with the Neo HPCC #1 grease.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on February 16, 2014, 04:20:07 PM
Need some help from the experts! I have the 2006+ exploder rear diff. I cut off the drivers side mount and got the diff installed. Now the fun begins. I had to trim the sub frame to get it to mount all the way up, but now I think the diff is too low.

The mustang flange is only about 1/4 inch from the subframe and the bottom of the ford diff mount is basically flush with the lip of the subframe.
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/20140216_1330301_zps91c255bf.jpg) (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/onefastrx7turbo/media/20140216_1330301_zps91c255bf.jpg.html)
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/20140216_1329581_zps3ac9a4af.jpg) (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/onefastrx7turbo/media/20140216_1329581_zps3ac9a4af.jpg.html)
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/20140216_1329281_zps0976a1c1.jpg) (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/onefastrx7turbo/media/20140216_1329281_zps0976a1c1.jpg.html)

Is this normal? I'd have to fill a large amount in on the weld and the hole in the ronin mount doesn't line up with the hole in the subframe if the bolt is in the diff mount. Is it possible that the diff mount flange is too thick? How do I fix this? I thought of milling the top of the delrin down to bring the diff up:
(http://i1197.photobucket.com/albums/aa431/onefastrx7turbo/20140216_1330131_zps8d94d673.jpg) (http://s1197.photobucket.com/user/onefastrx7turbo/media/20140216_1330131_zps8d94d673.jpg.html)

If not that then maybe there are more differences in the 06+ exploder diffs than just the extra mount. Perhaps the location of the mounts are different and the position of the pinion is different as well? Anyone have any thoughts?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on February 16, 2014, 06:12:46 PM
I had to make some slight mods for my delrin bushings to fit,(delrin in the diff and the frame) also modified the hole some on the weld in piece where the bolts goes through. I modded my frame a lot because I'm running 1350 joints.  I believe Ash, (Large orange font) can give you more feed back on the mustang flange. I believe that the solid mounts make it a little harder to line everything up over stock or poly units. I dont think that the 06+ housing is any different in the areas that matter.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on February 16, 2014, 06:19:57 PM
Thanks! I think you're right about the solid mounts; everything is rigid and there's no compliance. I think that even if I modded the subframe to allow more clearance for the pinion, the main mount bolt hole in the Ronin mount is at least 5/8's off if I'm lining up the mount against the hole in the sub frame for the tie link as you did....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 18, 2014, 12:03:42 PM
The nose of your diff needs to rotate up by about 3/4" vs the picture you have shown.  The bottom of the Ford front diff mount (the tip that protrudes from the housing) wants to be flush with the the pinch weld you show in the first shot.  You're showing the aluminum about 3/8" below the pinch weld, and the protruding bushing hangs ~3/8" below that.

Best guess, it's the plastic bushings you're using in back.  You're likely going to need to ream those open to get it to rotate up.  We did add a note about this into the instructions and there's some chatter in this thread about it, but both were a couple months back.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on February 18, 2014, 02:27:53 PM
Just wanted to throw in a comment about my recent experience as a precaution to the hardcore roadcourse guys. This is not a problem with the Ronin kit at all, just an extra step you might want to consider if you plan on heavily open tracking your car.

I just got back from a track day and found my driver side outer CV boot has "vented" from the band clamp on the stub axle and expelled some grease onto the hub area, brake caliper and inside of the rear wheel.

An easy indication that this is happening is seeing grease or oil spatter on the inside of your wheel.

This can happen because of excess heat associated with HPDE or open track racing. When I say excess heat, I mean rear brake rotor temps above 450F when coming off the track. To quantify this, I'm running DOT R compound tires, race brake pads, and driving the car hard. You wont see these heat levels on a car with street tires and brakes.

When I built my halfshafts I used the black CV grease that came with the boots. This grease is probably fine for 95% of us. If you plan do drive your car in extreme anger, often, for extended periods of time I suggest ditching the standard CV grease for some synthetic or other higher quality grease, at least for the outer CVs. Also be cognizant not to overfill the CV with an extreme amount of grease. 

My first attempt to solve this problem will be to clean out and repack both my outer CVs with better grease. I will use fresh CV band clamps and make sure they are as tight as possible

Neo HPCC #1 is an excellent CV/bearing grease used by Nascar, F1, Indycar and ALMS teams, but it is $70 for a pound. I don't think I need grease that nice. I am going to try the Neo CV500 grease that is half the price. It is probably good enough for my needs.

There is also the Redline synthetic grease which is $12.

I didn't see this when it was posted.

I talked with the guys that build our axles at work when I was assembling mine.  They told me that for starters, the inner tripod bearings want a different type of grease than the outer CV joints.  (I don't remember the specifics of this, I will have to check back into it later)  They also mentioned that most people over grease the joints and that causes excessive heat build up.  It is surprising how little grease you really want in there.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on February 18, 2014, 06:34:12 PM
The nose of your diff needs to rotate up by about 3/4" vs the picture you have shown.  The bottom of the Ford front diff mount (the tip that protrudes from the housing) wants to be flush with the the pinch weld you show in the first shot.  You're showing the aluminum about 3/8" below the pinch weld, and the protruding bushing hangs ~3/8" below that.

Best guess, it's the plastic bushings you're using in back.  You're likely going to need to ream those open to get it to rotate up.  We did add a note about this into the instructions and there's some chatter in this thread about it, but both were a couple months back.


Thanks Joel!! So I need to enlarge the holes in the delrin or switch to rubber mounts (for compliance)? Would that make the rear mounts clunk on accel or decel? Alternately, could I achieve a similar effect by shaving down the tops of the delrin mounts?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on February 18, 2014, 06:40:14 PM
i shaved and slightly angled the tops of my mmr bushings.  also opened up the holes a bit.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 18, 2014, 06:45:42 PM

The nose of your diff needs to rotate up by about 3/4" vs the picture you have shown.  The bottom of the Ford front diff mount (the tip that protrudes from the housing) wants to be flush with the the pinch weld you show in the first shot.  You're showing the aluminum about 3/8" below the pinch weld, and the protruding bushing hangs ~3/8" below that.

Best guess, it's the plastic bushings you're using in back.  You're likely going to need to ream those open to get it to rotate up.  We did add a note about this into the instructions and there's some chatter in this thread about it, but both were a couple months back.

I drilled the bushing holes out and did not shave the top of the bushing. You will get some NVH and clunking from the solid mounts, but the diff does not move. It is held from pivioting at the front mount. and is very solid.



Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on February 18, 2014, 06:51:20 PM
Thank you very much Joel, Antirotor and Largeorangefont. I'll bust my drill out and enlarge the delrin mounts. Any guidance on the enlargement amount?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 18, 2014, 08:16:09 PM
Go slow, I forgot how much I drilled them out, but I did it a couple times, and just enough to let the diff pivot as much as I needed. That will help to keep the diff locked down.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on February 19, 2014, 08:25:11 AM
thank you sir!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 19, 2014, 11:59:40 AM
You can also use a drill in the same size hole you have, stick it through and then drive it over at an angle (thereby cutting with the side of the bit).  As Ash said, go slow.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on February 19, 2014, 02:01:28 PM
Sounds good. Thanks Joel! Looks like I have a project this weekend. I'll modify it to achieve the 3/4" I need for clearance. I'm concerned about positioning the mount at such an angle where I can't weld the mount parallel to the diff if that makes sense..
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 19, 2014, 06:26:24 PM
The mount is going to land pretty much where the mount wants to land.  I would suggest you tack the cantilever mount with the diff in place with front bolt installed to be sure it lines up.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on March 02, 2014, 11:09:34 AM
Hey guys, something I have noticed on Russ' race car several times before the crash is the driveshaft bolts had loosened at the pinion flange. I used OE Ford bolts with Loctite and everytime I nut/bolted the car they were loose. I am thinking that I may go with studs, nuts, lockwashers on the new car.

Any thoughts, input, etc. would be welcome.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 03, 2014, 12:25:26 PM
Hi Charlie,

Does the Ford setup use lock nuts with the bearing straps?  My yoke (can't remember if that end is moser or strange atm) uses deformed metal lock nuts at the straps (aka c-lock nuts).  That makes sense to me but that type of nut is not intended for re-use so you'd need spares on hand.  A better choice yet might be nord-lock washers.  Those things are bad ass and we use them in Ronin's brake kit.

Any sign of deformation or crushing on the bearing itself?

Anyone else had this issue?  I'd like to add some best practice recommendations to the install instructions.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 03, 2014, 12:30:28 PM
BTW the above assumes you're running a yoke (which I thought Russ was), is this actually a small pattern pinion flange we're talking about?  I just re-read what you posted.  If so this sounds pretty unusual.  You'd think if we had some abnormal vibration you'd feel it and I'd be surprised if the clamp didn't have enough friction and was slipping to work the joint.  There's no interference inside the joint correct?

If this is a flange we're talking about, Nord lock washer's would probably be my first attempt at resolution.

http://mdmetric.com/nordlock/Nord-Lock%20-%20Locking%20function.htm (http://mdmetric.com/nordlock/Nord-Lock%20-%20Locking%20function.htm)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on March 03, 2014, 01:59:52 PM
What about some Stage 8 fasteners?    Possible?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on March 03, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
Joel, not running a yoke. We are running the small Ford flange and there is no noticeable vibration.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 03, 2014, 06:49:24 PM
Joel, not running a yoke. We are running the small Ford flange and there is no noticeable vibration.

Well you got my attention Charlie. I will check mine this week when I get the car back in the garage for some service.

I have the same setup - Small ford flange, OE Ford bolts, and Ford bolt on pinion yoke.

There is no interference inside the joint. The Yoke sits on the flange, The bolts simply bolt the yoke to the flange.

That is odd that they are coming loose considering every Mustang from 94 to 2004 uses the exact same parts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 03, 2014, 07:05:05 PM
I will take a look at mine as well since I am running the exact same setup.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on March 03, 2014, 07:58:11 PM
Well, Smith18's setup is now sitting in my garage.  Hope to be putting it in sometime in the near future! 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 11, 2014, 12:47:14 AM
I have done some modifications to the rear delrin mounts. Its much closer to lining up and now the issue is the mustang flange hits the subframe, err, I should say the bolts hit the subframe. Not sure this is an issue since I don't have them drawn in (theres no DS yet). My last and hopefully final dumb question. Can I induce some preload via the ronin weld on mount? Not a lot but just enough to get the extra little bit of clearance at the pinion. I don't want to crack anything and I don't have faith my welds will hold haha!!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 11, 2014, 10:39:51 AM
Just use a spacer to raise the front of the diff up a bit.. That is what I did.

Also check your pinion angle vs the trans output. Using the spacer actually helped me get the pinion angle correct.

Check earlier in this thread or check my build thread. I had aluminum spacers made for the front diff mount.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 11, 2014, 11:59:35 AM
thanks LOF. I I saw your thread about that and I was going to use your idea. It sounds like using the spacers will force the pinion angle and in turn preload the front mount to some degree. Should be ok then
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 23, 2014, 02:26:46 PM
Well, thanks to everyone's help I have the rear subframe and axles in. Im using FD rear rotors and the axle nut isn't even close to being able to perform its' function. I might shave it down somehow. I get maybe 3 or 4 turns and that's it. At the risk of being a pain in the ass, I have another question :yay:  I'm going to measure for the driveshaft next. I've read the instructions on how and where to measure from. My question is, on the pinion flange, should I measure from the "bottom" of the flange (closer to the transmission) or from the top (theoretically further from the transmission)?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 23, 2014, 04:06:54 PM
the rear rotor should have absolutely nothing to do with the axle nut going on.  if you are not getting the axle nut on right then your axle must not be seated in the hub properly?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 23, 2014, 04:53:43 PM
I'll check again but I'm pretty sure it was seated all the way in. I should tell you I'm using the 626 outer CVs with the shorter spline area. I figured that the FD rotors might have more width in the splines which would exacerbate this problem.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on March 23, 2014, 04:59:00 PM
The axle nut doesn't have anything to do with the rotors.   You can take the entire braking system off the car and put the axle nut on.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 23, 2014, 06:57:50 PM
I understand that. the only reason I brought it up was because people were already having problems using the 626 outer CV's and not having enough thread engagement. Im using the supplied nut which came with the axle and I get maybe 3 turns on it. I mentioned that FD rotor only because i thought maybe that part of the rotor on FDs was wider (longer splines) than the FC rotor which would make the thread engagement even less....
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 23, 2014, 07:00:30 PM
Earlier in the thread RX7V8Builder posted about finding some suitable outer cv joints from a late 80's Mazda 626 turbo.

TII cv joint:  bearing shoulder to axle tip 4", bearing engagement length .5", bearing shoulder to end of spline a bit over 2.625"
626 cv joint: bearing shoulder to axle tip 3.5", bearing engagement length .5", bearing shoulder to end of spline a bit under 2.5"


So the 626 cv joint is .5"  shorter overall, and loses a little over .125" of spline engagement as well.  I do not feel very comfortable with this.  Anyone else have any other thoughts?  RX7V8Builder, did you get different results?

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/sidebyside.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/626nut.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/turbonut.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/626nonut.jpg)

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v21/miataracer/turbononut.jpg)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on March 23, 2014, 07:27:00 PM
I'm using the aftermarket outters Ricardo (rx7v8builder) found and the nut engagement is just like the second pic on my car. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on March 23, 2014, 07:57:19 PM

This is what mine looked like when I installed the CV Joints:

(http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj90/reguzmans/RX7/DSC01207.jpg) (http://s270.photobucket.com/user/reguzmans/media/RX7/DSC01207.jpg.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on March 23, 2014, 08:32:01 PM
You are asking about the HUB, not the ROTOR, that's why we are confused.  :)

The HUB might be deeper, yes.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 23, 2014, 10:01:07 PM
Are you running a washer behind the nut? If yes take off the washer. If not then it sounds like the CV is not fully pushed into the drive hub, or the drive hub is not fully pressed into the rear wheel bearing.

For the driveshaft measurement measure the face of the pinion flange closest to the transmission.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on March 23, 2014, 10:03:21 PM
of note.  i did not end up running those axles.  they were chinese trash.  i am using 929 outers on my car.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 25, 2014, 11:52:33 AM
You are asking about the HUB, not the ROTOR, that's why we are confused.  :)

The HUB might be deeper, yes.

God I'm such an idiot sometimes... I cannot explain why my brain associated the rotor with the hub splines. You are right digitalsolo.

LOF, the nut supplied with the axles is one piece with a built in washer. I measured it at right about .832 tall, taller than the factory RX7 nut without the washer. I still have the T2 axles, I'm tempted to redo the axles with the T2 outers...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 25, 2014, 12:47:33 PM
Ahh it sounds like your nut might be different that some of ours. 

Are you using the GKN outer CVs?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 25, 2014, 06:44:36 PM
No sir, these are the Chinese junk sold by Rockauto  :yay:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 25, 2014, 06:49:47 PM
Ok that's fine.. Probably just the nut.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on March 25, 2014, 06:53:27 PM
I think its an M18X1.5...Ive been looking on Mcmaster and have found a few but the ones Im finding are rough 1/2 inch tall but I cant stake the axle. How important is that anti rotation locking feature?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: digitalsolo on March 25, 2014, 07:40:15 PM
Very important.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on March 28, 2014, 12:08:20 AM
Any other tricks on outer TII CV removal from the stock RX7 axles, short of clamp/twin bottle jacks approach?  I've been beating the hell out of this thing, and it doesn't seem to want to come off.  Is there another clip or something I'm missing?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on March 29, 2014, 03:56:42 PM
I got it!  This should save someone a TON of time someday...

To remove your TII outers from the axles:

-Remove diff side CV boot clamp
-Remove outer retaining ring
-Remove snap ring holding on the bearing retainer and remove the retainer
-Slide off CV boot
-Remove CV boot clamp and CV boot from the TII outer side
-Take a piece of tubing bigger than the axle (I used 1 3/4" roll cage tubing)
-Find something the same diameter as the CV bearing race.  It just so happens that the inner bearing race you pressed/cut off of the drive flange when you removed it from your hubs to replace a broken wheel stud is the perfect size for this.
-Place axle through your old wheel bearing, and then slide into roll cage tubing
-Whack butt of tubing twice on the ground, and voila!  TII outer pops right off


I beat that thing in a vice like it was a redheaded stepchild, and it didn't budge so much as a fraction of an inch.  10 seconds worth of drop time on the piece of tube/pipe, and it was done. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on March 29, 2014, 05:09:53 PM
Aaaand, that's the end of these outers. 

Second side was stuck even worse, and after beating with blocks of wood and mallet, I take a close look at the race and see two cracks in it.  Looks like its time to buy some 626 outers and cross my fingers that they hold up. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on March 29, 2014, 11:22:46 PM
Wrong thread.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: project dc2 on March 31, 2014, 11:48:59 AM
soo.. have the brackets been made and shipped out to people using hte kit already ?
 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 31, 2014, 12:00:43 PM
Philip,
Yes these have been shipping since we announced them, PM sent to double check yours.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 05, 2014, 11:03:25 AM
The german-made outers from Ricardo look/feel much more substantial than the cheapie aftermarket units.  They also have considerably less play than my factory outers at this point. 

Now if only I hadn't forgotten the snap ring when trying to install one of my wheel bearings following a red-eye plane flight home...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 08, 2014, 10:02:58 AM
Question for those of you using the 626 outers or the ones from Ricardo - there are two wire rings/clips on the outer CV side of the axles.  My axle popped in just fine past that first clip, and I can feel it seated in there (give it a pull, and it doesn't just slip out, you can feel it in the retainer groove).  Is the axle fully seated at this point, or does it need to be driven in further so that the second clip is also not exposed?  There's about 1/4" or so between the CV joint race and that second clip as it sits right now.   
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 08, 2014, 10:26:55 PM
Figured it out. Even these replacement CV's lose about 1/8" of spline engagement. There's a groove in the bottom to engage the clip rather than the CV being centered between the two clips like the factory CV, so they don't seat as deep.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: airwolf16 on April 09, 2014, 07:22:02 PM
finally got some funds to order this kit over the weekend!!!   ohhh yea! looks like a great product and problem solver.

cant wait to see it!

I have N/a axles on my FC. would there be any reason to upgrade the outer CV?  if so, what would be reccomended?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 09, 2014, 07:38:51 PM
finally got some funds to order this kit over the weekend!!!   ohhh yea! looks like a great product and problem solver.

cant wait to see it!

I have N/a axles on my FC. would there be any reason to upgrade the outer CV?  if so, what would be reccomended?

The splines into hubs are the same between NA and T2, but the splines from shaft to CV are larger on the turbo version.  The Ronin 8.8 needs the bigger splines and won't work with NA CVs.   FWIW I recommend contacting Ricardo (v8rx7builder) about the 626 turbo CVs (the known alternative to T2 CVs).  They're new parts of high quality and make the build easy.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 09, 2014, 07:40:17 PM
I don't think the NA outers are the same spline as the turbo outers, and therefore can't be used with the axle shafts that come with the kit.

Joel would know for sure.

Edit: Joel tree'd me.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: airwolf16 on April 09, 2014, 11:40:14 PM
I was looking for Ricardo (v8rx7builder) on the forum under members and could not find his contact information.

however i did re-find the ls1 build thread where Joel is using these CV outers and i like the idea of that.

are there part numbers or such for this outer CV?

Edit:  I was just reading through the service bullitin and i believe i found ricardo!! i hope i did anyways, I PM'ed RX7V8Builder about the information as well.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 10, 2014, 05:51:12 PM
Sorry about that... I reversed his handle.  It should be "RX7V8Builder".  Post on the CV info starts at #239 in this thread.

http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=5084.msg122830#msg122830 (http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=5084.msg122830#msg122830)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: airwolf16 on April 10, 2014, 09:04:52 PM
no worries. i did find all that info last night as well, thanks for all your help along the way.

I did get in contact with ricardo and did order them tonight.

thanks again every one!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 11, 2014, 09:17:45 PM
So my replacement Timken bearing isn't even CLOSE to fitting the bore of the upright.  In fact, the entire assembly is about 1/16" short, and the tolerances are so far on the low side, the entire bearing is actually rocking around in the bore.  Grab the drive flange and move it side to side, and you hear it click-clacking as far as the snap ring will let it move. 

Word of caution - talking to my friend the RX7 guru, he said to just buy the Mazda bearing.  Part No. is 26-151.  He has tried them all, and says it is a complete crapshoot as to whether you will get one that fits properly.  I'm going to give the Timken bearing one last shot since RockAuto is sending me a replacement while I wait for Mazda Motorsports to update my membership (hadn't submitted race results in a while). 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 11, 2014, 10:27:18 PM
I got Timken bearings from Rock Auto for my rear hubs and they worked perfectly. Maybe it's a crapshoot ordering the bearing, but if you have the right part number I can't see it being an issue. I've done 3 of them with no issue at all.

Timken 510010
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: airwolf16 on April 12, 2014, 12:26:01 AM
yes i just changed my rear bearing with timken as well. 510010 is the part number. heating the race left on the hub was the easiest way for me to remove it.
ordered mine through summit raciing

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/tmk-510010/overview/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/tmk-510010/overview/)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on April 12, 2014, 01:10:24 AM
I also used Timken 510010 bearings in the rear with no issues. FWIW, I work for Honeywell Aerospace and we use Timken bearings in most of our turbine engines...
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 12, 2014, 11:05:13 AM
Timken 510010 is in fact the part number.  I did not have issues with the driver's side bearing, passenger side isn't even in the ballpark. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 12, 2014, 07:15:21 PM
Got to looking at the part #'s earlier after cutting the bearing race off.  Both are NTN, both had one number in common, but the other number was different between the two.  The two look identical from the naked eye, so not sure if it was incorrectly boxed from the factory or not. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: airwolf16 on April 13, 2014, 08:02:13 PM
haha i had to go to autozone and get another one. i assembled the bearing to the hub shaft first.... to find out that i could nto get the c-clip on..... luckily Autozone had one.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on April 16, 2014, 08:36:50 PM
No problems with the new bearing, it's finally in!

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: airwolf16 on April 18, 2014, 10:33:24 PM
yay!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: kartermdb on May 06, 2014, 01:32:27 AM
It fits! 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: boost! on August 10, 2014, 08:13:26 PM
Hey guys -
Pretty much finishing up my 8.8 swap. Joel, thanks for the smooth transaction - you rock. This kit has been a breeze to put together and follow. I have a question for you expert FC 8.8er's.

Can I use my C4 aluminum driveshaft? I'm assuming it would have to be modified - extended? I will be getting the "small" Ford 8.8 pinion flange. If so, what needs to be done for the C4 driveshaft to be used? I plan on taking it to a local driveshaft shop with the Ronin instructions. Also, the measurements from the T-56 to the differential were spot on - 38 3/4inches.

-Alex
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 10, 2014, 09:34:23 PM
No, you need a driveshaft longer than a C4. I have not seen a driveshaft extended, so I am not sure if that is something that can be easily done. You will need a custom made driveshaft or you could get a SN95 V8 Mustang driveshaft to work with modifications like shortening, balancing and the proper front yoke. They come with the proper rear yoke.

The stock driveshafts are steel, but you can find used aftermarket aluminum replacement driveshaft on Mustang forums or EBay usually.

Using a mustang steel driveshaft will be cheaper if you are on a budget. You can get a used steel unit for less than $100 shipped typically.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: boost! on August 10, 2014, 10:08:52 PM
Thanks for the info! I'll likely just have the local driveshaft shop make a custom one. I am thinking aluminum with 1310 or 1330 joints. I take it they can make one by just giving them the details on the pieces I need and letting them know the driveshaft's total length has to be 38 3/4?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 10, 2014, 10:14:01 PM
Yes. You'll probably have to use 1310 u joints to use the correct yokes.  I have the 1310s on mine and have the SN95 Mustang rear setup. Mine is a custom made driveshaft.

Typically a driveshaft shop can deal with the pinion flange to trans dimension.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on August 11, 2014, 11:07:57 AM
Using the C3 Corvette style front yoke right ?

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Demon on August 11, 2014, 01:14:49 PM
Boost, once you get the rear end in, trailer the car to pattersons and drop it off... they are stupid cheap and will be much better if they have the car there for measuring, and they will probably install it for free too.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 11, 2014, 01:27:50 PM
Using the C3 Corvette style front yoke right ?

Steve

Yes you will need this front yoke no matter what with the Mustang pinion flange setup, unless you want to remove the rear subframe to install the driveshaft.

http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p9_corvette_transmission_slip_yoke_1310_series_u_bolt_style_27_.html (http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p9_corvette_transmission_slip_yoke_1310_series_u_bolt_style_27_.html)

As far as any of us know, the 27 spline C3 2 piece slip yoke above is only available with 1310 U joints. If you want to use 1330 or 1350 U joints you need to go to a pinion yoke on the 8.8 diff instead of the small Mustang pinion flange. That *SHOULD* allow you to remove the driveshaft without dropping the subframe. Something like this:

http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p35_ford_8.8_1350_series_chrome_moly_pinion_yoke_with_hardware.html (http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p35_ford_8.8_1350_series_chrome_moly_pinion_yoke_with_hardware.html)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: boost! on August 11, 2014, 01:51:02 PM
Boost, once you get the rear end in, trailer the car to pattersons and drop it off... they are stupid cheap and will be much better if they have the car there for measuring, and they will probably install it for free too.

Damon -
The rear end is already in the car. I have a guy coming to weld the sub-frame brace tonight. I took measurements for the drive shaft already, and they are the exact same as in the Ronin installation manual. 38 3/4. I'm dropping off the parts for the axles and drive shaft specs tonight at Indy Rack and Axle - I plan on giving them the drive shaft information pages from the Ronin manual as well.

I think I should be good.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on September 18, 2014, 07:44:29 PM
I ordered my kit today.  :cheers:

Getting everything together for the Winter project. Still need to source a carrier and stub shafts.  (just hope the current diff holds out for the next few weeks)

What's everyone using for a clutched LSD? Stay with a rebuilt stock or aftermarket unit?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on September 18, 2014, 11:17:36 PM
Congrats, you won't be disappointed.  I'd recommend using Mazda Comp mounts instead of solids.  The solids are not needed to stop wheel hop.

I am using the trac-lok lsd that came with the carrier, but rebuilt it using the Ford Racing carbon clutches.  No issues on the street or the track.  I've also had great luck using the aftermarket GKN outters, if you want to be able to sell your current diff and axles complete.

A quick note about the driveshaft.  I know that the 2 piece Corvette yoke (same as linked above) is recommended, but a standard 1 piece isn't really a big hassle to install.  I figured this out when I twisted the 2 piece yoke and went with a 1 piece forged unit.  Actually, I think it's a bit easier because you don't have the subframe in the way while trying to install the pinion flange bolts.  You don't have to completely drop the subframe, just drop the front enough to get the driveshaft in.  I leave the shocks attached, unbolt the cross member and torque link, and lower the front down with a jack.  As many times as I'm sure you've had the subframe out, this should be easy peasy.  Plus, you can reuse the yoke you already have.

If you have any more questions feel free to ask.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 19, 2014, 12:53:35 AM
I ordered my kit today.  :cheers:

Getting everything together for the Winter project. Still need to source a carrier and stub shafts.  (just hope the current diff holds out for the next few weeks)

What's everyone using for a clutched LSD? Stay with a rebuilt stock or aftermarket unit?


Excellent!

New Cobra spec Traction Lok clutch LSDs are $219 shipped. The rebuild kit if your carrier came with an LSD is $79 for standard clutches, and $119 for the cobra carbon clutch rebuild kit. The kit to replace all hardware, bearings and seals in the case is $79 shipped. The outer half shaft seals are the only thing that don't come in that kit. They are rarely bad, but you can get them at your Ford dealer.

If you want a Torsen style diff for better traction in corners, the Detroit True Trac is what you want and they are about $450.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on September 19, 2014, 08:36:25 AM
Congrats, you won't be disappointed.  I'd recommend using Mazda Comp mounts instead of solids.  The solids are not needed to stop wheel hop.

I am using the trac-lok lsd that came with the carrier, but rebuilt it using the Ford Racing carbon clutches.  No issues on the street or the track.  I've also had great luck using the aftermarket GKN outters, if you want to be able to sell your current diff and axles complete.

A quick note about the driveshaft.  I know that the 2 piece Corvette yoke (same as linked above) is recommended, but a standard 1 piece isn't really a big hassle to install.  I figured this out when I twisted the 2 piece yoke and went with a 1 piece forged unit.  Actually, I think it's a bit easier because you don't have the subframe in the way while trying to install the pinion flange bolts.  You don't have to completely drop the subframe, just drop the front enough to get the driveshaft in.  I leave the shocks attached, unbolt the cross member and torque link, and lower the front down with a jack.  As many times as I'm sure you've had the subframe out, this should be easy peasy.  Plus, you can reuse the yoke you already have.

If you have any more questions feel free to ask.



Good to know about the yoke and I'll look into the GKN outers. It would be nice to sell my current setup to someone as a whole unit.
"As many times as I'm sure you've had the subframe out, this should be easy peasy." (Understatement of the year.  :D )




Excellent!

New Cobra spec Traction Lok clutch LSDs are $219 shipped. The rebuild kit if your carrier came with an LSD is $79 for standard clutches, and $119 for the cobra carbon clutch rebuild kit. The kit to replace all hardware, bearings and seals in the case is $79 shipped. The outer half shaft seals are the only thing that don't come in that kit. They are rarely bad, but you can get them at your Ford dealer.

If you want a Torsen style diff for better traction in corners, the Detroit True Trac is what you want and they are about $450.


I'm leaning towards the Cobra spec Traction Lok. My car is kind of a universal project. Road course one day drag strip the next.  ;) 
I think I found a place to get the carrier. A friend of mine (Jim Kilpatrick) who helped me build my motor said he has a source. Pretty much specify what I want and this place has it. We'll be rebuilding it no matter what.

Thanks for the info guys.  :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Cman on September 19, 2014, 08:44:49 AM
I got a brand new Ford Racing Trac-Loc from Tousley for $175  :yay: This was 18 mos ago or so, and I picked it up. This is a great mod. On my home road course I went from 10 shifts per lap to 4 and I recently got 27mpg on a road trip. I went with 3.55 gears. A local yard sold me a diff center section and two axles for like $230.

Steve
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on September 19, 2014, 09:59:09 AM


Good to know about the yoke and I'll look into the GKN outers. It would be nice to sell my current setup to someone as a whole unit.
"As many times as I'm sure you've had the subframe out, this should be easy peasy." (Understatement of the year.  :D )



The GKN outters are the same that were discussed earlier in this thread.  A member, RX7V8Builder (Ricardo), is who you want to talk to unless Ronin now has the connection to get them. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on September 19, 2014, 11:08:55 PM
If you are going to buy a new diff and rebuild the entire thing, try to get an explorer carrier with an open diff.. It will probably be cheaper.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on September 20, 2014, 12:53:23 AM
older rwd  929 outers work as well.  that is what i am using in my car and i have beat on them pretty hard with good luck so far.   the 929 stuff is pretty available on car-part.com


the new gkn are probably nice parts but stay away from parts store axles.  the remans are junk and the *new* parts are chinese junk.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on October 01, 2014, 10:19:44 AM
Hate to post this but last night I broke the driver side axle at the outer turbo 2 CV. Bolt on lt1 3600 stall 700r4 m/t drag radial et streets. Normal 60' is 1.60-1.68 leaving at 2000rpm. Runs 12.0 at 111. Not making crazy power, any reason why the axle broke?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: lt1fc3s on October 01, 2014, 10:23:53 AM
 :confused:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on October 01, 2014, 03:20:57 PM
Bummer,

Good news first, halfshafts do have a lifetime warranty from our supplier, so we'll get you squared away. 

If you don't mind, as with all issues, we prefer to do all investigations into failures offline rather than publicly.   I don't see a reason why it should have failed at this kind of power levels, however, I want to keep all discussions between directly affected parties until we determine a cause of failure.  We'll post findings for the forum once available.

PM sent with a little more info.
-Joel

PS if anyone else ever has any issue with any Ronin part, please reach out to us directly at roninspeedworks@gmail.com.  Doesn't matter if you're the original owner or not.  We'll do what we can for you.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on October 07, 2014, 04:30:11 PM
I ordered my kit today.  :cheers:

Getting everything together for the Winter project. Still need to source a carrier and stub shafts.  (just hope the current diff holds out for the next few weeks)

What's everyone using for a clutched LSD? Stay with a rebuilt stock or aftermarket unit?


Excellent!

New Cobra spec Traction Lok clutch LSDs are $219 shipped. The rebuild kit if your carrier came with an LSD is $79 for standard clutches, and $119 for the cobra carbon clutch rebuild kit. The kit to replace all hardware, bearings and seals in the case is $79 shipped. The outer half shaft seals are the only thing that don't come in that kit. They are rarely bad, but you can get them at your Ford dealer.

If you want a Torsen style diff for better traction in corners, the Detroit True Trac is what you want and they are about $450.



Do you happen to have the part number I need to order the Cobra spec Traction Lok clutch LSD?
I stopped by a local Ford dealership today. I asked for a price on a  Trac Lok LSD for a 2004 Mustang Cobra. He didn't really seem to understand what I was talking about.
He brought up a screen with the blow-up parts list for the carrier, axles, LSD, etc. I pointed to the LSD and he said that part is $125.
I asked him if it was 28 or 31 spline and he didn't know. I asked if it was the clutched LSD and he didn't know that either.
I can get the 28 spline stub axles for $50 each from the place I got my 2004 Explorer 3.73 Open Diff carrier from.
With my 400hp at the wheels I don't think I need the 31 spline plus I'm not planning on any more power adders.  :scratch:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 07, 2014, 04:38:33 PM
M-4204-F318C

Don't spend more than $219 for one. You must use a 31 spline differential because the Explorer inner CVs are 31 spline.

http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/products/8.8--TRACTION%252dLOK-LIMITED-SLIP-DIFFERENTIAL-31T.html (http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/products/8.8--TRACTION%252dLOK-LIMITED-SLIP-DIFFERENTIAL-31T.html)

Full housing rebuild/gear change kit part number is M-4210-B2 .. $79 here:
http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/8-8-ring-gear-and-pinion-installation-kit/ (http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/8-8-ring-gear-and-pinion-installation-kit/)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on October 07, 2014, 05:48:52 PM
M-4204-F318C

Don't spend more than $219 for one. You must use a 31 spline differential because the Explorer inner CVs are 31 spline.

http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/products/8.8--TRACTION%252dLOK-LIMITED-SLIP-DIFFERENTIAL-31T.html (http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/products/8.8--TRACTION%252dLOK-LIMITED-SLIP-DIFFERENTIAL-31T.html)

Full housing rebuild/gear change kit part number is M-4210-B2 .. $79 here:
http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/8-8-ring-gear-and-pinion-installation-kit/ (http://www.buyfordracingfromdpm.com/8-8-ring-gear-and-pinion-installation-kit/)

Great! Thanks for the info. I'll see if it's the same part number that the Ford parts guy showed me.
I didn't realize the Explorer diff was 31 spline. I thought it was 28. I can buy the axles that came out of the carrier I have for $50 each from the place where I got my carrier.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on October 23, 2014, 04:30:36 PM
Hey Ash,
Is the Explorer pinion flange the same as the Mustang flange?
I guess what I'm asking will the Explorer flange work with my Diff cradle or do I have to get the Mustang flange for clearance?

BTW, I ended up buying a new ring and pinion gear set also. I went with the Ford Racing 3.73 with the Hob process grind.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on October 23, 2014, 07:41:29 PM
Don,

You need the small 79-04 Mustang GT flange. The Explorer flange is the larger diameter flange, commonly referred to the "Cobra" flange. Info and part number for the small flange is below. You can see the small flange just fits. I would get the Ford 12 pt driveshaft bolts as well they come in a pack of 4. Part number is N800594-S100

Since you are rebuilding the entire diff at this point you could also put in a solid pinion spacer. It eliminates the crush sleeve for setting bearing preload, and makes the assembly slightly stronger. Ratech makes the kit for $15. Since you are staying with Ford gears, the spacer/ shim stack will be the same thickness as the crush sleeve in your current diff.

3 inch aluminum driveshaft on my car.

Here is the small flange clearance to the FC subframe.

Part number for the small Mustang Flange is E9SZ-4851-A



(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2242.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on October 23, 2014, 08:02:14 PM
Thanks.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on October 29, 2014, 04:25:00 PM
I just want to advise anyone that's thinking of doing this swap:

Go through the pages in this thread. You will not be disappointed. There is a wealth of information here. (and pretty pictures to boot  :D )
All the questions I had when I first started to post were answered previously. (Thanks to everyone who has been patient with re-answering the same questions)

As I was going through the posts I created a Google Doc called 8.8 Swap notes and copy/pasted pertinent information into it.
I have access to that document from anywhere if I have questions in my mind.

I have my parts purchased and now just need to start assembling. I'll take pictures of the process.  :cheers:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: just startn on November 13, 2014, 09:54:50 PM
I notched the Subframe for the 1350 U-joint (Hoping its enough).

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3831.jpg)  (http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3833.jpg)   

I then added a 1/4in thick steel plate to the bottom side for added strength.

 (http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3834.jpg)

I will mention, the subframe is a very dirty piece. The steel its made out of is also fairly nasty. It was quite the task welding it

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3835.jpg).

Showing all the areas the Diff Case need's clearanced.

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3836.jpg)
(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3837.jpg)
(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3838.jpg)
(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3840.jpg)

Next im going to modify this strap. A large washer will be welded onto the underside of the strap so it will contact the entire face on the topside of the of the bushing.

(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3842.jpg)
(http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t298/240sxrx7/rx7/IMG_3841.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on November 14, 2014, 06:41:46 PM
It does not matter, but you must have an early IRS Explorer rear diff. I have never seen a cover with 75w90 on it before. Be sure to run 75w140 diff fluid.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on November 16, 2014, 09:07:07 PM
I think you'll be fine.  I bought my subframe used with a 1350 u joint, and it clears without issue without any notching.  What I fear is that I am going to have to drop everything and notch it for driveshaft clearance, though, since the T101a output shaft seems a smidge lower than the T5 :(
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on December 04, 2014, 06:38:00 PM
Just wanted to point that we take concerns with our parts seriously.  I just posted up findings from an 8.8 shaft failure analysis routine we conducted in the FC 8.8 service bulletin thread.
http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=18885.msg274459#msg274459 (http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=18885.msg274459#msg274459)

Regards,
Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on December 16, 2014, 03:17:23 PM
Don,

You need the small 79-04 Mustang GT flange. The Explorer flange is the larger diameter flange, commonly referred to the "Cobra" flange. Info and part number for the small flange is below. You can see the small flange just fits. I would get the Ford 12 pt driveshaft bolts as well they come in a pack of 4. Part number is N800594-S100

Since you are rebuilding the entire diff at this point you could also put in a solid pinion spacer. It eliminates the crush sleeve for setting bearing preload, and makes the assembly slightly stronger. Ratech makes the kit for $15. Since you are staying with Ford gears, the spacer/ shim stack will be the same thickness as the crush sleeve in your current diff.

3 inch aluminum driveshaft on my car.

Here is the small flange clearance to the FC subframe.

Part number for the small Mustang Flange is E9SZ-4851-A



(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_2242.jpg)


Went to make all the measurements for the new driveshaft. I realized at that point that I accidentally ordered the 1350 (E9SZ-4851-B) companion flange on the diff. I really didn't want to mess with clearancing the subframe to be able to use the 1350.
I spoke with the guy who rebuilt my diff and he said to order the 1310 flange (E9SZ-4851-A) and he'll swap it out no problem and will only charge me a 6 pack to replace the flange and verify the pinion depth.
I stopped by the place who will be making my driveshaft (Machine Service in Waukesha) and he quoted me $275 for a new 3" tube steel shaft with new one piece slip yoke and the pinion flange to mate with the 1310 companion flange.
I decided not to go with the 2 piece slip yoke. In my mind the one piece seems stronger. Especially since MoparX twisted his and also went with the one piece.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on December 26, 2014, 10:12:21 PM
That's a steal of a deal, Bikedad.

My driveshaft ended up in the $450 range.  Sitting on the floor of the garage, fingers crossed that I ordered the correct length and everything clears tomorrow.  I was able to get the 1350 rear u joints with a 1330 style front with the Corvette style 2 piece trans yoke, Spicer solid u joints, held together with some 3" DOM steel tube. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: PapioGXL on January 08, 2015, 03:53:29 PM
So if you don't use a 2 piece front yoke, you just need to drop the subframe down some to get the shaft in correct? I'm planning on using a 1350 yoke on the diff instead of a companion flange.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on January 08, 2015, 04:00:52 PM
So if you don't use a 2 piece front yoke, you just need to drop the subframe down some to get the shaft in correct? I'm planning on using a 1350 yoke on the diff instead of a companion flange.

That's pretty much kind of what I did. I mounted the diff to the pins, installed the DS then raised the subframe. I found it much easier to install by myself that way.
I've done the full cradle install before but always ended up messing around getting the 4 mount points to not bind. With 2 people it's not a problem but I seldom have 2 people available when I'm installing the rear end. (I've probably had it out 10 times now  :P )
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on January 09, 2015, 12:03:50 AM
With the subframe already in the car you can get the driveshaft in by lowering the front of the subframe.  First, support the front with a jack.  Next unbolt the front of the diff, the camber link, the subframe bolts, and loosen the shock bolts but don't remove (so the bushing won't get damaged by rotating subframe).  At this point you will be able to lower the front of the subframe to get the driveshaft in.  Once that's done you can just put it all back together.  I personally think it's easier than having to work around the subframe to get the driveshaft bolts in.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fc3sls3 on January 12, 2015, 02:02:45 AM
I have installed two of these kits now and so far my biggest complaint is the lack of pinion angle built into the kit. I also find I have had to remove sooo much material out of the subframe I am kinda thinking I should gusset it on the bottom side. It would be cool if you would build a kit based off the Ford t-bird 8.8. They are stronger, cheaper and you can find them everywhere. Minus that they seem ok, a few guys up here in Canada still seem to have a bunch of wheel hop tho. :S
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on January 12, 2015, 01:09:10 PM
I have installed two of these kits now and so far my biggest complaint is the lack of pinion angle built into the kit. I also find I have had to remove sooo much material out of the subframe I am kinda thinking I should gusset it on the bottom side. It would be cool if you would build a kit based off the Ford t-bird 8.8. They are stronger, cheaper and you can find them everywhere. Minus that they seem ok, a few guys up here in Canada still seem to have a bunch of wheel hop tho. :S

Since some parts of the above come across as criticisms I wanted to offer some thoughts and logic on why we designed what we did.

-Pinion angle, we designed the front mount with a moderate pinion angle that should be a good starting point for most folks.  One reason we recommend you tack weld the front mount with diff in place is so that you can check that.  We tried to design this so that you can shim upward slightly as needed. I ended up adding a 1/16" shim and my pinion angle was perfect vs. Ronin engine mounting (equal and opposite).  The side support tabs are slotted so that you have the option of shimming adjustments.  Tipping of subframe can be done with an aftermarket center link if desired and you need to drive the landing lower.

-You should only need to cut the subframe if you run 1350 u-joints.  There's little to no cutting with 1310 joints as others have shown.  I'm not sure when you last purchased one of these (thanks for your business by the way!) but install instructions now include details and recommendations of the cut process if you desire to run the big u-joints.  You need to remove about 3/8" from the top surface.  I did gusset the bottom side of mine and that is noted as an optional step in the instructions as well.

-We've looked at the Ford T-bird case in the past, but choose not to do so as it is a more challenging fitment since the dual front mount compromises the vertical link attachment point.  Andrew Borodin's original FC 8.8 kit used a cobra diff with this form factor and he had to have users ship cores of subframes back and forth since the modifications were so extensive.  My opinion:  We've never heard of a customer breaking a case on any of our 8.8s so the arguments about strength are moot and there's no reason to add unnecessary weight.  02-05 Explorer's should be easy to come by at many junkyard.  If not you can always find them on ebay.

-Wheel hop...  sorry about that.  Wheel hop can be a PITA and can occur from a variety of sources.  Shoot us an email if you want troubleshooting support.  Worst case you might consider a custom solid front mount instead of  the Ford rubber bushing.  Unfortunately this may be custom mount as I'm not aware of any available off the shelf.  From personal experience I can say that our kit is substantially improved relative to wheel hop than the weak side-mount tab apparatus that Mazda gave us from the factory.  My first ever burnout that was 100% free of wheel hop was right after I installed this kit.  I was so excited I took a picture of the elevensies even though the tracks were downright weak.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/NoWheelHop.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on January 16, 2015, 09:00:32 PM
Does anyone know the change in driveshaft length going from a TII diff to the 8.8?  (ie, how much more length do you need).

It would make my life a lot easier.  Thanks.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on January 16, 2015, 09:45:32 PM
I would PM Bikedad, he might know or be able to take a measurement. Joel might know as well.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on January 25, 2015, 08:45:34 PM
It's in.   :wave:

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7279.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7279)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on January 26, 2015, 03:52:37 PM
Does anyone know the change in driveshaft length going from a TII diff to the 8.8?  (ie, how much more length do you need).

It would make my life a lot easier.  Thanks.

Just in case anyone needs this info in the future, after mocking up and measuring, I had to add 6" to my driveshaft. (going from a TII differential to a small mustang flange 8.8 )

but as many people cautioned me, measuring your driveshaft yourself is always better.  If it was me, I wouldn't trust my measurements :)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on January 26, 2015, 03:56:38 PM
Does anyone know the change in driveshaft length going from a TII diff to the 8.8?  (ie, how much more length do you need).

It would make my life a lot easier.  Thanks.

Just in case anyone needs this info in the future, after mocking up and measuring, I had to add 6" to my driveshaft. (going from a TII differential to a small mustang flange 8.8 )

but as many people cautioned me, measuring your driveshaft yourself is always better.  If it was me, I wouldn't trust my measurements :)

I concur.  ;)
(I think I'm a little long on mine but will find out soon enough. I have about 3/8 of space from the edge of the slip yoke to the rear seal on the trans.)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Kovah41 on February 04, 2015, 02:20:04 PM
Its has been a while since I read thru this thread so I thought I would read up. I completed my conversion two years ago and been beating the thing up drifting since. This thread is has a unreal amount of info in it and should be read by anyone doing this swap. Best how to manual hands down. I love this swap and continue to beat this thing and it just keeps taking it. Thought I would throw this testimonial in. Thanks again Ronin Family for this setup!!!

Evan
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on February 05, 2015, 12:38:27 AM
just because I haven't seen anyone do this yet...

instead of making a custom block off plate, I decided just to drill and tap the ABS sensor hole with 1/2" NPT and put a pipe plug into it.  I think it turned out pretty good (much better than my crappy angle grinder job haha)

(https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-GQ9_FrVNmH4/VNMAyfJzr0I/AAAAAAAAG94/G6Ni5YfS1w4/s800/IMG_20150204_224409379.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: PapioGXL on February 05, 2015, 01:55:19 AM
I was wondering what thread would be closest. I'm planning on doing similar, but tapping it to run a DIYautotune hall effect sensor for a wheel speed sensor.I know their sensor will work with the teeth on the ring, the cherry sensor I currently have is questionable.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on February 05, 2015, 10:33:47 AM
I was wondering what thread would be closest. I'm planning on doing similar, but tapping it to run a DIYautotune hall effect sensor for a wheel speed sensor.I know their sensor will work with the teeth on the ring, the cherry sensor I currently have is questionable.

yeah, 1/2" NPT is pretty darn close.  I think I measured the hole as 0.681" with my calipers, and the drill bit for a 1/2" NPT tap is 45/64" = 0.703

putting a wheel speed sensor on it isn't a bad idea...(I was just thinking I didn't need it for ABS) but at that point you probably just want to keep the stock one.  I'm not sure what kind of sensor it is though.  You're fairly space limited up there and it'll be hard to get the sensor the correct distance from the tone ring.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: PapioGXL on February 05, 2015, 10:48:52 AM
1.5 mm air gap, and it's m12x 1.0 thread. Screw it in till it stops, then back it out 1.5 turns.  :cheers:

Otherwise there are some cherry sensors that may bolt right in, I'll need to make some measurements to see if they'd fit.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 05, 2015, 07:15:33 PM
FYI - Ford makes a plug that just bolts in and is O ring sealed. It is a couple bucks.

It comes on all the Explorers that do not have the ABS tone ring on the diff.

Seen here:

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0255.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on February 05, 2015, 07:27:15 PM
FYI - Ford makes a plug that just bolts in and is O ring sealed. It is a couple bucks.

It comes on all the Explorers that do not have the ABS tone ring on the diff.

Seen here:

(http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a386/largeorangefont/IMG_0255.jpg)

Ha!  I thought you guys were making those.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on February 05, 2015, 08:32:48 PM
FYI - Ford makes a plug that just bolts in and is O ring sealed. It is a couple bucks.

It comes on all the Explorers that do not have the ABS tone ring on the diff.

Seen here:



That's what mine has.  :)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on February 05, 2015, 08:43:45 PM
Do either of you guys have the Ford PN for that plug?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on February 05, 2015, 09:18:17 PM
Do either of you guys have the Ford PN for that plug?

My diff carrier came with it. I don't know what the part number would be. Sorry. :-[
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on February 06, 2015, 02:28:07 PM
Do either of you guys have the Ford PN for that plug?

I just did a quick search for it and couldn't find it, but did find this which is probably just as good (and probably way cheaper if you get one locally):
http://eastcoastgearsupply.com/i-4985641-ford-8-8-abs-sensor-freeze-plug.html (http://eastcoastgearsupply.com/i-4985641-ford-8-8-abs-sensor-freeze-plug.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on February 06, 2015, 02:48:45 PM
Yeah - I did see those as well.

I stopped at both of the local Ford dealers in my area and neither parts gut could come up with the stock block off plate.  I could likely find one at the junkyard, but they are all under a couple feet of snow this time of year. 

I am hoping that somebody may have solved the PN issue or possible have one they could sell me.  :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 06, 2015, 02:59:22 PM
I had the part number at one time for the part. I'll see if I can find it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on February 07, 2015, 04:47:22 PM
Ronin Team or anybody for that matter...

Does anyone know if you need to clearance the subframe if using the 1330 to small pinion flange to replace the 1310 unit.  I am talking about the one Joel referenced in the install write up.   

http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p373_1330_series_flange_yoke_fits_7.5_and_8 (http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p373_1330_series_flange_yoke_fits_7.5_and_8)

The reason I am asking is that I can only find a 1350 two piece front yoke that mates with my 31 spline output Tremec tranny.  It seems funny to have a 1350 on one end and only a 1310 on the other.  I doubt that I will be making more than 500 HP but I have broken 1310s before at under that power level at the strip with sticky tires and hard launches.  Much heavier car though.

I do like the convenience of being able to pull the driveshaft without touching the rest of the drivetrain so I do want to keep the two piece.

But if I have to clearance it anyway I might as well go for the bigger joint even though it wil be major overkill for my setup.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on February 07, 2015, 11:24:34 PM
Ronin Team or anybody for that matter...

Does anyone know if you need to clearance the subframe if using the 1330 to small pinion flange to replace the 1310 unit.  I am talking about the one Joel referenced in the install write up.   

http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p373_1330_series_flange_yoke_fits_7.5_and_8 (http://www.dennysdriveshaft.com/p373_1330_series_flange_yoke_fits_7.5_and_8)

The reason I am asking is that I can only find a 1350 two piece front yoke that mates with my 31 spline output Tremec tranny.  It seems funny to have a 1350 on one end and only a 1310 on the other.  I doubt that I will be making more than 500 HP but I have broken 1310s before at under that power level at the strip with sticky tires and hard launches.  Much heavier car though.

I do like the convenience of being able to pull the driveshaft without touching the rest of the drivetrain so I do want to keep the two piece.

But if I have to clearance it anyway I might as well go for the bigger joint even though it wil be major overkill for my setup.

If you look at the size of a 1330 vs a 1350, they're the exact same diameter, so yes, you'll have to clearance the subframe just the same:
http://www.driveshaftspecialist.com/HTML%20Measure/UJ%20ID%20Guide.html (http://www.driveshaftspecialist.com/HTML%20Measure/UJ%20ID%20Guide.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on February 08, 2015, 03:47:44 AM
I was thinking that it was the Larger diameter pinion flange that you have to use with the 1350 was the actual interference problem and not the joint itself.  I was under the impression that was the reason Joel had asked about locating a 1350 DS flange that mates to a Mustang diameter pinion flange.  There would be no reason to ID that part if you need to clearance the subframe anyway.  Or perhaps the large Explorer flange is way too big and that is why he ended up with a yoke on the pinion end.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 08, 2015, 10:55:12 AM
Explorer flange is way too big. See the pictures above in post 696. The small Mustang flange just fits.

If you want to go 1350 u joints, you need a yoke that bolts to the pinion.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on February 08, 2015, 11:11:01 AM
If it's just an issue with that being the only 2 piece yoke available, it's not a major issue to run a 1 piece yoke instead.  I've switched to a 1 piece and Don also used one with his build.  I don't think a 2 piece makes it any easier to remove the shaft.  I only run 1310 u-joints (small mustang flange) and even with those small joints I have problems getting the flange bolts out because the socket hits the shaft.  I would think trying to bolt up a larger 1330 or 1350 would be even more difficult.  The subframe doesn't give much room to work in so it's easier to just lower the front enough to get the driveshaft installed.  And if you're going to lower the subframe anyway it doesn't make much sense to run a more expensive 2 piece yoke. 

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on February 08, 2015, 02:00:15 PM
I ended up with 1350 rear u joints and a 1330 two piece trans yoke.  Able to get at the 1350 cap nuts easily from the backside of the subframe, and can drop the driveshaft out no problem without having to move anything. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on February 08, 2015, 02:03:34 PM
I could not find any 1310 slip yokes available to mate with the 31 spline Tremec.  Just 1330 and 1350 in one piece and just 1350 in detachable.  So I was questioning the practicality of using two different joint sizes.  I do have a call into Denny's to see if I can sort it out and if running different sizes front and back makes any difference.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on February 08, 2015, 07:21:52 PM
Makes no difference in staggering sizes front to back, the weak link is the weak link.  It will balance out just fine. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 01, 2015, 01:21:48 PM
I was getting ready to start building up my axles using the GKN outers and realized that I need the large Circ Clip that one would normally get from the TII axles set.  Since I am not disassembling a set of axles for this I don't have the clip.   Not exactly sure why I thought it would be in the kit.   For those of you who have used the GKN outers or are planning to - where are you sourcing the large clip?  Part Number??

Thanks 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 01, 2015, 02:41:51 PM
You don't need any Circ clips from TII axles, they are already in the GKN outers I believe. The axles will lock into the outers when you insert them.

I don't remember putting any circ clips on the outer sides of my axles.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 01, 2015, 03:33:57 PM
I thought Joel specifically mentioned harvesting the large clips from the TII axles.  I also thought that the clip in the GKN kit was just the small one - perhaps they are both there.  I will go take a closer look at all the parts and see where I am making the mistake.  I do have some pictures of a TII shaft somewhere that shows the clips.   Maybe that is where I am making my mistake.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 01, 2015, 08:51:48 PM
OK - back from the information gathering.  Please bear with me on this.

Clearly Joel talks about removing the large inner clip from the TII outers and also installing same clip on the new axles.

http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=1274.msg226291#msg226291 (http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=1274.msg226291#msg226291)

Since Joel is saying that he is using the GKN Outers I am assuming the large clip needs to be there since he installed it.

One thing I noted was that the clip has a nice flat counterbore to rest against in the TII outer but the GKN has a large deep chamfer so there is really no exact spot for the clip to bear on.

Based on what Joel has shown I believe that I still need the large Circ Clip when using the GKN Outers.  The only clip contained with the GKN kit is the small clip used at the outer groove on the axle.  There is no other clip in the kit and you can see by the picture that there is no other clip in the CV.

So - back to the original question - where can I get them if not from a TII axle set ?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 01, 2015, 10:20:04 PM
FWIW I took nothing from turbo axles to build my axles. All I had were Explorer halfshafts, GKN outers and Ronin axle bars.

I could be wrong, but if you are reusing the Turbo II outers you'd need to make sure you got them.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 02, 2015, 05:41:18 AM
LOF - I hear you and understand that you have a fair amount of track time on your install without issue.  However, I am still a little unsure of the reason why Joel apparently installed the inner clip despite using the new GKN Outer CV.  Really hoping that Joel would chime in since only he would know why he felt it was important to need the large inner clip. 

Since the axle bar itself "floats" between the two joints I can see the benefit of wanting a hard stop on the outer joint.  If a hard stop is not needed for the GKN then it really should not be needed on the TII since the outside clip configuration is the same for both.   I suspect that forces could be generated that would overcome the retaining pressure of the rather small outer clip.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 02, 2015, 03:37:21 PM
Couple comments from the thread above recently.

-It's simple to cut the ABS sensor flush so it becomes a plug.  You have two leads embeded in plastic but it's solid otherwise.

-Someone remind me, do both the 626 and T2 CV's have a groove in the splines for the bling spring clip or is that ring just living in the void beyond the splines of the CV?  If it's the former, then the snap ring on the shaft is just redundancy against the shaft slipping in too deep.  If it's the later than you need the snap ring to prevent the shaft from doing so.  If you do need on a clip, I'd just hit mcmaster carr.  They don't have the same thing but this might be a contender...  http://www.mcmaster.com/#91665a467/=w4zbyh. (http://www.mcmaster.com/#91665a467/=w4zbyh.)  They're a little narrow so you could stack two of them in the groove width we provide.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on March 02, 2015, 06:23:13 PM
Joel - Yes that is the difference.  I looked at both CVs and the TII joints have no groove for the small spring clip and the GKN does have a groove.  So, if using the TII joint in the Ronin kit you would absolutely need the thick ring to provide the stop for the axle traveling too deep into the CV cavity.  There would be no need for the thick clip when using the GKN joints.  It is redundant but since the GKN has such a large lead in chamfer, there is really no place for the clip to land.

As far as the ABS sensor - I did see that you ground yours flush and would do the same.  It was just that the proper plug was reportedly just a few bucks so I thought I would try to find it.

Thanks

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 04, 2015, 12:47:23 PM
Bill,

I'm using the GKN outers and the snap ring still fit on mine.  I don't have a picture of the fitment but I know I'm running it.

(https://sites.google.com/site/frijoleels1fc/10DSC_0616Custom.JPG)

As you noted if the blind internal spring clip lives in a groove then other one is only redundancy.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 04, 2015, 03:35:56 PM
So I'm currently installing the fc 8.8 ronin kit.

Running into an issue where when the front diff mount needs to be welded to the sub frame, the diff needs to move forward about 5/16 to get the mount to be where it needs to be.

Has anyone else ran into this issue?

Did I get a bad batch or something?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 04, 2015, 07:39:38 PM
So I'm currently installing the fc 8.8 ronin kit.

Running into an issue where when the front diff mount needs to be welded to the sub frame, the diff needs to move forward about 5/16 to get the mount to be where it needs to be.

Has anyone else ran into this issue?

Did I get a bad batch or something?

Jeff,

Are you running solid diff mounts?  If so then, I'll lay odds that you missed the part in the instructions where solid mounts can bind on the rear main studs.  You'll need to ream those open a hair to get the diff to rotate up and forward into position.  It's about the only issue on fitment we've had.  These are all built on fixtures so we might have very small variations after welding (weld always moves things slightly) but it shouldn't be possible to be as far off as you describe.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 04, 2015, 08:16:59 PM
I didn't miss that part, and actually already tried that before posting.

The front mount piece that you sent me fits the sub frame very nice, but it just isn't long enough or something.

After reaming out the solid diff mounts a good bit, the diff is able to be angled, however, it doesn't help the distance that the diff needs to be moved forward.

Very frustrated at the moment, this isn't going as smoothly as I'd hoped.

About to make a custom front mount here shortly if this thing can't be resolved.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on April 04, 2015, 08:38:57 PM
Post a picture of it from the bottom and side when attempting to line it up?

when I test fit mine the diff was slightly out of position (on top of the toe link mount) and it lined up all wrong, but once I got it in the right place it lined up perfectly.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 04, 2015, 11:23:39 PM
Whose solid bushings do you have?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on April 05, 2015, 08:52:56 AM
Are you also running solid subframe mounts ?  Were they clearanced as well?  The reason I ask is that my original MMR subframe mounts were very tight on the mounting studs and I needed to clearance and oblong those to allow rotation of the subframe.  That was with the stock diff set up - but it caused similar fit up problems. 

+1 on the pictures
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 06, 2015, 09:01:26 AM
I'll try to get some pictures tonight after work.

Yes running solid diff, and sub-frame mounts.

Didn't clearance the sub-frame mounts, didn't see mention of that in the write-up.

My mounts are custom made from nylon going off stock specs. Did ream the diff mounts out s bit, and seeing how the fitment issue was, also cut down the top a bit to try to raise the diff off the sub-frame. Didn't appear to resolve the issue though.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on April 06, 2015, 09:05:53 AM
I originally was going to use my MMR Delrin diff bushings but changed my mind after the first mounting. I didn't feel like dealing with the clearancing so ended up purchasing the Mazda Pro Comp bushings instead.
Everything lined up beautifully then.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 06, 2015, 09:24:07 AM
So basically I should change my mounts...

Do the ones you're referring to hold up for a decent amount of time?

Anyone have a link to them? Also, what style/where to get sub-frame mounts?

Will the partsbymax sub-frame mounts work with this, or should I just go factory style?

http://www.partsshopmax.com/page.php?66 (http://www.partsshopmax.com/page.php?66)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on April 06, 2015, 09:34:40 AM
I ordered the Pro Comp diff bushings from Mazdatrix.
I've only had my Ronin 8.8 in for about 100 miles but really like the feel of it over the delrin. They're supposed to be a great upgrade over the stock bushings.
LargeOrangeFont (Ash) could give you more info on the delrin stuff. He tracks his car and is very knowledgeable.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on April 06, 2015, 01:13:41 PM
The mazdatrix parts are as follows:  Prepare for sticker shock because they are definitely more expensive than you would think they should be - but all the mazda parts are.

Rear Diff Comp Mounts:  PN 28-8900-FBY1 @ $55.26 each

Rear Subframe Mounts: PN 28-8400-FB43 @ $97.60 each


Mazdatrix.com
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 06, 2015, 01:31:21 PM
Appreciate the responses, I went ahead and ordered the diff mounts, and the pbm sub frame mounts.

You're right, $200 for 2 sub-frame mounts is silly.

Hoping this will remedy my issue.

I'll update in the next week or so when they arrive and I get a chance to test it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on April 06, 2015, 02:42:29 PM
The pmb pieces are interesting - but the way I read their info is that you  "must" use their solid diff mounts if you use the spherical ball subframe mounts.  It sounds like it is ok to use only their solid diff mount alone which indicates that the geometry is not changed though.

Good luck with the spherical mount - let us know how they work out.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 06, 2015, 03:21:24 PM
Jeff,

Glad you're getting this squared away.  I'll update the install instructions with some stronger language regarding what needs to happen with solid mounts.  They're unforgiving in terms of letting you rotate the diff up to land where it needs to.  Since the rear mounts are from above, rocking the diff up also pushes the front mount on the housing forward.

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on April 06, 2015, 03:25:07 PM
Appreciate the responses, I went ahead and ordered the diff mounts, and the pbm sub frame mounts.

You're right, $200 for 2 sub-frame mounts is silly.

Hoping this will remedy my issue.

I'll update in the next week or so when they arrive and I get a chance to test it.

The PBM subframe bushings raise the subframe a bit to attempt to correct geometry (that probably doesn't need correcting imho).  Their subframe bushings don't have a top to even this out.  you might run into additional issues running mazda diff bushings with PBM subframe bushings.

Bowtie7 on this forum sells a spacer for the PBM subframe bushings to make them stock thickness again.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: RX7V8Builder on April 06, 2015, 08:53:06 PM
I have the Mazdatrix Pro Differential bushings and PBM spherical bushings in my setup now.  I am also using the spacers made by Bowtie7 on top of the PBM sphericals to make them the same height of the original subframe mounts. I also run the PBM camber arm to aid in camber adjustment


I used to have solid subframe mounts with the Mazda Pro differential bushings and the stock subframe camber arm when I first installed my 8.8.
Everything lined up perfect during the original install and continued to be the same after the installation of the MAX spherical subframe mounts and adjustable camber arm.


A 5/16" misalignment seems a bit too much, specially when nobody else has run into this issue before.  Is there a possibility your subframe could be bent?

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 06, 2015, 11:33:15 PM
I have the Mazdatrix Pro Differential bushings and PBM spherical bushings in my setup now.  I am also using the spacers made by Bowtie7 on top of the PBM sphericals to make them the same height of the original subframe mounts. I also run the PBM camber arm to aid in camber adjustment


I used to have solid subframe mounts with the Mazda Pro differential bushings and the stock subframe camber arm when I first installed my 8.8.
Everything lined up perfect during the original install and continued to be the same after the installation of the MAX spherical subframe mounts and adjustable camber arm.


A 5/16" misalignment seems a bit too much, specially when nobody else has run into this issue before.  Is there a possibility your subframe could be bent?

No, I don't think my sub-frame is bent.

Your setup is was a bit different from mine, I have solid sub-frame, and diff mounts.

I do have the pbm camber arm as well.

Once the comp diff mounts, and pbm sub-frame mounts get here I will test fit again. Also should probably get the spacers you are talking about.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 07, 2015, 11:26:02 AM
Just to reiterate..

If you ordered PBM subframe mounts you need to PM Bowtie7 and get his spacers for the PBM subframe bushings. The PBM subframe bushings raise the subframe in the chassis, and will cause extra problems with the pinion angle for you unless you space them down to a stock height.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 07, 2015, 11:42:13 AM
Yeah, apparently my bad luck continues, PM'd him last night, he has none left.

Anyone have a picture of these things so I can possibly make my own?

I'm about over rx-7's haha, such a colossal pain in the ass to get anything done.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 07, 2015, 02:52:56 PM
They are very simple Delrin or UHMW spacers.

Contact these guys Via Ebay. They have or did have subframe mounts. Their diff and subframe mounts may be interchangeable, I do not remember for sure.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rx7-Rx-7-FC-Rear-Solid-Differential-Mounts-Turbo-FC3S-/110906828507?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19d28fe6db&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rx7-Rx-7-FC-Rear-Solid-Differential-Mounts-Turbo-FC3S-/110906828507?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19d28fe6db&vxp=mtr)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on April 07, 2015, 07:29:54 PM
They are very simple Delrin or UHMW spacers.

Contact these guys Via Ebay. They have or did have subframe mounts. Their diff and subframe mounts may be interchangeable, I do not remember for sure.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rx7-Rx-7-FC-Rear-Solid-Differential-Mounts-Turbo-FC3S-/110906828507?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19d28fe6db&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rx7-Rx-7-FC-Rear-Solid-Differential-Mounts-Turbo-FC3S-/110906828507?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19d28fe6db&vxp=mtr)

Ash, those are the standard Delrin subframe bushings. The pieces we had done drop in to the upper portion of the PBM 2 piece bushings to make them stock thickness. PBM bushings were made to raise the subframe up for the slammed drift cars effectively changing roll center but not really in a good way for us especially when running bigger tires. I think I had some pics of bushings on here somewhere.


Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on April 07, 2015, 07:46:50 PM
Just posting a couple pics of my clearanced subframe only because I stiffened it a little different than most have done.

Since the subframe flexes pretty easily before all the material is removed I deffinitely think that something does need to be added to stiffen it back up after clearancing it for the 1350  u-joint.  I chose to add the stiffeners on the front and back vertical surfaces using 3/16 thick material.  They are a minimum of .75" tall which basically is 2.5x stiffer than a 4 inch wide x 1/4" thick plate that most people have used.

The parts were a bit of a pain to make though because of the curvature but I think they came out OK.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 07, 2015, 09:47:58 PM
They are very simple Delrin or UHMW spacers.

Contact these guys Via Ebay. They have or did have subframe mounts. Their diff and subframe mounts may be interchangeable, I do not remember for sure.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rx7-Rx-7-FC-Rear-Solid-Differential-Mounts-Turbo-FC3S-/110906828507?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19d28fe6db&vxp=mtr (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rx7-Rx-7-FC-Rear-Solid-Differential-Mounts-Turbo-FC3S-/110906828507?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item19d28fe6db&vxp=mtr)

Ash, those are the standard Delrin subframe bushings. The pieces we had done drop in to the upper portion of the PBM 2 piece bushings to make them stock thickness. PBM bushings were made to raise the subframe up for the slammed drift cars effectively changing roll center but not really in a good way for us especially when running bigger tires. I think I had some pics of bushings on here somewhere.





Agreed Charlie. I was just offering the guy other possible avenues to get this fixed, as using the PBM subframe  bushings on their own, without your spacers will cause more problem than it solves.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on April 12, 2015, 08:53:24 PM
Another happy Ronin Speedworks customer.  :wave:

http://youtu.be/J_tZq8kzQ4E (http://youtu.be/J_tZq8kzQ4E)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on April 12, 2015, 10:42:45 PM
I'm insanely jealous.

Grats on getting yours working!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 13, 2015, 12:24:57 AM
You'll be selling another one of these soon Joel. Robert blew up his Turbo diff today at Willow Springs.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on April 16, 2015, 02:38:52 PM
My kit is finally done an installed!

a few notes of things I found.

- How to make a driveshaft (fairly rotary specific, but my still be useful to some)
http://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/how-make-your-own-aluminum-carbon-driveshaft-1081644/ (http://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/how-make-your-own-aluminum-carbon-driveshaft-1081644/)

- when setting the pinion angle, it's a pain in the butt to actually measure the pinion angle, and measured the angle of the ronin mounting ears and it worked great.  Your results may vary...

- Motive Performance 5.14s are loud as crap

- grease your u-joints before you install the driveshaft...


autocross this weekend to test it out!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 16, 2015, 03:07:56 PM
Awesome.

And yes any gear other than OEM Ford is loud.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on June 01, 2015, 11:10:55 AM
I have a question regarding the installed angle of the diff relative to true horizontal.

First of all the car was leveled to within .1 degrees prior to starting this.

I installed the empty diff case in the cradle, mounted it in the car, torqued the nuts and then measured the starting angle of the diff prior to installation of the subframe. 

The angle was 1.2 degrees pointing down. That surprised me a bit because I just assumed the nominal position of the diff would be pointing up since in general the angle of the engine/trans is down AND you NEVER want them pointing in the same direction from a driveshaft operation point of view. (So I've been told)

Is this initial measurement typical?  For those of you who actually adjusted the pinion angle at the diff/subframe mounts – how much could reasonably be obtained there?

This is basically the first part of a much larger issue that I will have with driveline angles in general, but I wanted to pole the FC RONIN 8.8  community and get some more information before I open up a new thread on that topic. 

Thanks for the help.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on June 01, 2015, 12:42:38 PM
Bill,

Without the subframe and front mount in place the case will just be hanging there so any slop in the bushings will show up as negative pinion angle.  What kind of bushings are you running?  Did you compare the range of pinion angle you can achieve with the bushings loose rather than torqued?   If your bushings are OEM or Mazda Comp (my favorite), the bushing themselves have enough compliance to get the front end where it needs to be.  If you're running some kind of solid bushing you may find you need to ream the hole at a slight angle to get enough compliance. 

-Joel

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on June 01, 2015, 01:11:49 PM
Thanks Joel.

I am using Mazda Comp Bushings and have them trimmed top & bottom as yours were done.  The case is empty (so I can lift it) and figured since the mounts were pretty stiff they would not let things hang that much - so I was a little surprised by the down angle.  I know I have some work to do getting the angles correct as I am starting with a 3.8 degree down Transmission angle and likely taller in the engine bay than the typical LS swap ( :banghead: Mopar swap  :banghead:)  I can move that a little though to try to get all the angles as correct as possible.  Doing nothing other than pinion movement I would have to bring the nose up about .80" from the "hanging position) and wasn't really sure if I could move things that far.

I just wanted to get some feed back at this stage to see where I was at.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on June 02, 2015, 10:30:50 AM
I'm still in the middle of my diff swap as well, just got the mazda comp mounts, and they flex a decent amount, I can move my diff(while hanging) a good 2 inches up and down.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on June 02, 2015, 12:45:56 PM
Thanks Joel.

I am using Mazda Comp Bushings and have them trimmed top & bottom as yours were done.  The case is empty (so I can lift it) and figured since the mounts were pretty stiff they would not let things hang that much - so I was a little surprised by the down angle.  I know I have some work to do getting the angles correct as I am starting with a 3.8 degree down Transmission angle and likely taller in the engine bay than the typical LS swap ( :banghead: Mopar swap  :banghead:)  I can move that a little though to try to get all the angles as correct as possible.  Doing nothing other than pinion movement I would have to bring the nose up about .80" from the "hanging position) and wasn't really sure if I could move things that far.

I just wanted to get some feed back at this stage to see where I was at.



I measured my driveshaft length with the diff hanging from the Mazda Comp bushings. I had them high and tight. I've come to realize I should have mounted the cradle with the carrier in place to take the measurement. When I installed the DS and bolted everything in place I found out my DS is about 1.5" too long. On hard 1 -2 shifts the slip yoke bottoms out. I only have about 3/8" of play. Driving and shifting normal there's no problem.
Fortunately for me it's a small $75 upcharge with a 1 day turn around from the place that made my DS.
My DS is just a 3.5" steel shaft so not a big problem.
I will be having the DS resized. I don't want to hurt the crush on the pinion or damage the tailshaft on the trans.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on June 08, 2015, 10:56:56 AM
I'm still in the middle of my diff swap as well, just got the mazda comp mounts, and they flex a decent amount, I can move my diff(while hanging) a good 2 inches up and down.

Are you talking about pushing the pinion up and down 2"?  If so I wouldn't worry about it, the front mount will secure the pinion just fine.  They're not meant to act like a solid, just a little stiffer than stock.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on June 08, 2015, 12:08:30 PM
Yes, but I wasn't saying it like a bad thing, I was saying it as a good thing, cause I had solids in there and the front mount wasn't lining up properly at all, now with the comp mounts it lines up really nice.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on June 09, 2015, 01:39:02 PM
Ahhh, that's what I get for not reading the back story.  I'm really glad I run the comp mounts in mine though.  Before we figured out the camber link tabs on the subframe were a weak link, my car was one of the first 2 or 3 to break them.  When it did the pinion flexed all the way up and hit the top of the trans tunnel.  If your car is still in the process, next time your under there try pushing the pinion all the way up until hit hits metal.  It's a long way.  I'm confident that if I'd been running solids something else would have broken.  The rubber mounts in the subframe and cradle let everything move just enough to no break.  I don't know what I would have done if one of the studs that hold the subframe or cradle to the body broke.  It's not like you can just get another one and swap them out. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on June 09, 2015, 01:58:42 PM
Yeah for sure, that would suck, I have a snubber there, so I'm not too worried about it flexing up too far like that.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on June 09, 2015, 02:48:36 PM
I think if you run fully solid bushings in the subframe and diff.. nothing moves and so nothing brakes. I have not welded in my reinforcement plates on yet (I need to) but sublink tabs have been solid so far. I am not doing drag launches though.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on June 10, 2015, 08:14:36 AM
Yeah for sure, that would suck, I have a snubber there, so I'm not too worried about it flexing up too far like that.

With this set up even with elastomer mounts I really don't think the diff snout should move much unless something breaks.  Snubber might possibly be good insurance.  How did you implement that?  Any pics?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on June 10, 2015, 03:25:43 PM
I left the snubber in place from when I was running the stock diff.  The u-joint chewed it up and you can see where the driveshaft rubbed.  The 8.8 doesn't even come close to touching the rubber, but I left it because I didn't want a hole there.

(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/jbob1979/photobucket-61346-1385437172892_zps2f6da2f0.jpg) (http://s247.photobucket.com/user/jbob1979/media/photobucket-61346-1385437172892_zps2f6da2f0.jpg.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: PapioGXL on June 16, 2015, 05:03:44 PM
I left mine in because I was too lazy to pull the nitrous bottle.  :wave:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on July 21, 2015, 05:23:24 PM
After trying 3 different differential vents on my autocross car I finally found one that won't puke oil out all over my hoosiers.

- first was just a crank case breather filter
- second was a long hose that ran to the opposite side of the car and mounted a filter to the edge of the gas tank.  the hose went as high as possible without drilling through the floor.
- Finally this:

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-dfvEDClKavo/VZdmNvi4bYI/AAAAAAAAHf8/I5t1mYgGgXA/s1280-Ic42/IMG_20150703_171837834.jpg)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-WmHksPaH7To/VZdman11_xI/AAAAAAAAHhY/1DEirBhXGik/s1280-Ic42/IMG_20150703_172802786.jpg)

(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-DlRHe5pEY2g/VZdmb6uAEsI/AAAAAAAAHhg/i1eidNyCKgQ/s720-Ic42/IMG_20150703_172826388.jpg)

I used a longacre diff breather (http://www.longacreracing.com/products.aspx?prodid=7704 (http://www.longacreracing.com/products.aspx?prodid=7704)) w/ an 1/4" NPT -> 3/8" barb adapter on it.  Clamped it on to my 40mm cusco strut bar with some fuel hose to take up the slack.

Autocrossed on sunday and it's bone dry and I'm happy.

(http://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.rx7club.com-vbulletin/2000x1010/80-11222820_856814681448_3024900091417160155_o_60674a21f6152f85cdf2875381aac9419a4d1c4e.jpg)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on July 21, 2015, 06:02:31 PM
I put an air tool filter thing on mine and I don't puke fluid?  :scratch:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on July 21, 2015, 06:07:47 PM
I put an air tool filter thing on mine and I don't puke fluid?  :scratch:

No offense, but my car most likely pulls quite a lot more lateral G that yours.  I never had a problem on the street.  just during autocross, and it got significantly worse with the slicks on.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on July 21, 2015, 09:34:23 PM
I run a long hose from the cover to a small vented catchcan mounted behind the left rear fenderwell. I think it is sold by jegs and I used -4 an hose. No leaks or puking after a full weekend of qualifying and racing on 315-30-18 R7 Hoosiers.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 22, 2015, 12:03:52 AM
I put an air tool filter thing on mine and I don't puke fluid?  :scratch:

No offense, but my car most likely pulls quite a lot more lateral G that yours.  I never had a problem on the street.  just during autocross, and it got significantly worse with the slicks on.

I think some of this depends on the rear diff cover too. Some of the covers have cast in baffles around the vent, and others don't. It depends on the year of your donor diff and cover. But yes, the more grip you have the worse this can get. I have never had an issue with my catch can setup.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on July 22, 2015, 07:25:06 AM
^^^^ This  - and some Explorer covers have an additional sheet metal cover as well.  Single screw in a boss cast in the housing held in with red loctite.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on July 22, 2015, 10:34:45 AM
^^^^ This  - and some Explorer covers have an additional sheet metal cover as well.  Single screw in a boss cast in the housing held in with red loctite.

I didn't realize there were different covers, but mine had the meal plate on it like that^
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 22, 2015, 10:47:53 AM
^^^^ This  - and some Explorer covers have an additional sheet metal cover as well.  Single screw in a boss cast in the housing held in with red loctite.

I didn't realize there were different covers, but mine had the meal plate on it like that^

Some people have had gear oil spewing out on regular street driving.. I think those guys are the ones with no sheetmetal baffle at all. I believe mine had no sheetmetal shield.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: theantirotor on July 22, 2015, 07:36:52 PM
Mine has the cast in baffles and sheet metal shield
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on July 24, 2015, 09:10:44 AM
Unrelated to what you guys are talking about right now, but I did finally get my kit in the car and fully functional about a month ago.

Did a full rebuild of the diff before putting it in, anticipating having around 400(ish)rwhp in the somewhat near future, I figured some taller gearing would be better suited for the car.

I put 3.73 gears in it, and maaann.... with the basically stock LS, it feels so sluggish now, and actually have to pay attention to what gear I'm in to be in the power.

Was I a bit too ambitious in my gearing choice, or will my goal hp make it even itself out?

I know a lot of the domestic guys choose this gearing as an upgrade to their cars, am I missing something or did I mis-calculate, or did I just get spoiled with the stock 4.10?

I'm on a stock ls1 and t56 tranny.

Other then the gearing, the swap is pretty sweet, I ran into silly problems on the swap due to my choice in mounts, but after I got all that worked out, it's been great.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on July 24, 2015, 10:46:57 AM
You're probably being fooled by the seat of the pants feel of 4.10 gearing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 24, 2015, 06:21:55 PM
I have 400 WHP with 3.73s. It is perfect and has plenty of torque in any gear.

When you up the power it will feel much better. Don't worry about it, you made the right choice.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on July 24, 2015, 11:52:24 PM
Appreciate the replies.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on July 26, 2015, 01:15:12 PM
Gear selection is something I spent a great deal of time agonizing over.  I picked the "right" gear for my setup several different times convincing myself that each new choice was the better selection.  I ended up going with 3:55 to try to combat the low 1st gear of my tranny.  I too will start off in the 400-450hp zone so I hope it was not a mistake.  Unfortunately my build is not going to hit the road this year due to recovering from medical issues though.

Here is mine TKO @ 3:55 compared to F-Body T56 @ 3.73 @6500 rpm with 25" tire which will be about right for the street version

FBody T56
Gearing:  2.66 / 1.78 / 1.30 / 1.00 / .74 / .50
Speed :      49 /  73  /  100 /  130 /  175 / 237

TKO
Gearing:  2.86 / 1.89 / 1.28 / 1.00 / .64 / na
Speed:       47 /   72 /   106 /   136 / 213 / na
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 26, 2015, 09:39:44 PM
I think you made the right choice with a 3.55 rear gear and your TKO. The fall off in 5th will be dramatic, but there is no real way to avoid that without changing 5th gear.

The car is going to rip with your target power level and that gear spread.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on July 27, 2015, 06:29:33 AM
Thanks for the input it is a bit reassuring.  TKO options a .82 5th which I almost went with, but since the car is multipurpose and likely see more street driving than track driving, the 2100 rpm highway speed cruise offered by the .64 was more attractive than the 2800 of the .82.

 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 27, 2015, 06:56:01 PM
No problem. If you were doing a track car the .82 would be excellent.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: stuwk on August 20, 2015, 07:43:34 PM
I apologize if this has already been asked, but do FD outers fit on the FC Ronnin axle stub? Then one could use an FD hub which is a larger diameter internal spline, which may help some of those who break them. An FD bearing will press into an FC rear knuckle to accept the FD hub.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Bowtie7 on August 20, 2015, 08:54:40 PM
Good evening gents. I wanted to bring something back up after finishing up prep on the race car last night. Be sure and check your driveshaft bolts regularly. I am running factory Ford 12 point bolts, cleaned, primed, loctited. They still loosen up after a couple of events. I wish there was room to run bolts, nuts with lockwashers like stock but I don't think it is possible. I don't think studs are either. Any ideas? Anybody else noticed this? Anybody else bother to check?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 20, 2015, 09:19:04 PM
I checked mine once late last year and they were ok, but it is time to check them again.

I did use a new set of factory Ford bolts with their loctite on them.
 With studs it might make removing the driveshaft a more tedious process. I wonder if a thin jam nut and lock washer would fit on the back side of the flange without hitting the diff case?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: mech-head on August 24, 2015, 01:25:30 PM
Is the bottom of the differential housing still an acceptable jack point for the rear of the car?  I would think yes, but you are definitely moving the loads from a cast item to the bolted joint between the cover and mount.

Thoughts???
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on August 24, 2015, 04:25:22 PM
Yep no problem. Jack away.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Heffe on August 24, 2015, 04:41:47 PM
Lifted mine from there a lot already, no issues.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: MoparX on August 26, 2015, 02:48:49 PM
I no longer use the diff as a jack point but have no data to prove it can't be done.  My reason is I don't want to put unnecesary load on the rear cover bolts. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: wes kiser on October 02, 2015, 10:32:52 AM
I have continued to lift mine from the diff.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: N2v8fcs on December 06, 2015, 03:15:40 PM
Ordered my kit for the 383 car the other day!
getting excited. :D
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on February 12, 2016, 05:33:44 PM
FYI - Spindle nut replacement for the 8.8 conversion

If you are using the GKN Turbo 626 outer CV, the spindle nut thread pitch is different than the thread pitch on the OE Turbo II outer CV.

For the GKN/Turbo 626 outer you need a M22X1.5 spindle nut. A 1980-2012 Honda Civic spindle nut is the exact nut that comes with the GKN outers - M22X1.5, 20mm height, and 32mm hex for a staked application.

Spindle Tite #05172 or another Dorman equivalent part is what you will be looking for at the auto parts store. These will be the cheapest option.

In a pinch, Toyota makes a very similar spindle nut that is used for most modern Toyota cars, but it is a 30mm 12 point. Ask for a spindle nut for a 2010 Camry.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: strangerdanger on February 17, 2016, 03:38:40 PM
Does anyone know how to get ahold of Ronin speedworks? I emailed and called/left a voicemail and been almost a week. I ordered the 8.8 kit and they left out a small part. 
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on February 17, 2016, 04:11:40 PM
Does anyone know how to get ahold of Ronin speedworks? I emailed and called/left a voicemail and been almost a week. I ordered the 8.8 kit and they left out a small part. 

Email is the best way.  Apologies but I don't have a record of any such email from you (and I triple checked).  Was it through the website or a direct note?  Can you please try again?  roninspeedworks@gmail.com.  We'll get you squared away
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: strangerdanger on February 18, 2016, 09:28:26 AM
Does anyone know how to get ahold of Ronin speedworks? I emailed and called/left a voicemail and been almost a week. I ordered the 8.8 kit and they left out a small part. 

Email is the best way.  Apologies but I don't have a record of any such email from you (and I triple checked).  Was it through the website or a direct note?  Can you please try again?  roninspeedworks@gmail.com.  We'll get you squared away

The pervious email's were sent using your webpage (newest email is direct at 8:25 am).

Thank you
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: loveb on September 12, 2016, 01:40:00 AM
Thinking of getting this incase my mazdaspeed diff goes bang. my main issue being that I'm in Australia so shippiung would probably be killer :(
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: ebdyguy on September 12, 2016, 07:46:49 AM
Where in Australia ?  I have a friend there who occasionally ships a container there and might be able to help you out.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on September 12, 2016, 12:21:09 PM
Thinking of getting this incase my mazdaspeed diff goes bang. my main issue being that I'm in Australia so shippiung would probably be killer :(

@loveb  It's not too bad.  We've sent several down under.  Shipping to Australia runs ~$250 for the kit.  We do quote international shipping by order so drop us a line at roninspeedworks@gmail.com and we'll take care of you.

-Joel
(for RSW)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on December 11, 2016, 04:18:41 PM
I would like to buy one of these kits how do I order one :scratch:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on December 12, 2016, 11:22:19 AM
I would like to buy one of these kits how do I order one :scratch:

http://www.roninspeedworks.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=104 (http://www.roninspeedworks.com/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=104)   :yay:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on March 04, 2017, 12:37:19 PM
witch rear subframe mounts should I use. i'm using stock rubber on diff front and rear .
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on March 04, 2017, 09:40:17 PM
witch rear subframe mounts should I use. i'm using stock rubber on diff front and rear .

Use Solid subframe bushings unless you're using a adjustable subframe link to adjust camber (which you shouldn't be)

The NVH addition is minimal.  The front subframe is solid mounted, why not solid mount the rear?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on March 04, 2017, 09:47:29 PM
Thought I posted this here, but it looks like I forgot.

I took my diff out a while back and the top mount was getting dug into and the lower rubber mounts it came with got completely crushed.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/l4drcK4TNxZ8zWZ9HUevED95geBE4FUEvpq_1nuKY8KStjn-LNTNLyGcAsaA9gBE-7XHaVnyu7bMTcPNoCUsmXcyXlvdU0S4LZYRol2-qsmsqe0SWV7jhitPkndToD35L-_ksDkzwEEjA_L4AK_YzecfWLJNy69DzYAjrbNYCd4U-HzGa9flgr3i5t3QQVjS1WZXmfaJET__yRa3A5r_wgPgf920IB6Nt81YgQKKAfaIY8thhAkph9WzEczaeL4r41P64rTUPfTUzrHozV8U3zWH7g6NUwu6dy5Az1FUQ9SkskhnKDLtWusiPTKuGfuctkKm0wyxDk5em9VSYsfx_J17ihf8OZcucFpth4qZHznJeJ12klo3A9QdPPWkLgKIBFrh1ep4N7WrhmmNoM36AJjIS8fZEXoiL2OwKFeGXtCTyTv-J-Zx5EigwPwqpFfztlL9Lp6OnEKC8P5KGR1pHXbfRu8_4R2Q66QPYhhpohbPxT8dULhCWi76l--niuNNVcr2PToGxGkg9QCStNN7sRyT3Bf6ijnvcd0Mkd5DwfzMoSZ0S-PBIXbVc4YpI3PMxUxN5-DJCSM6cO7sR0HsCpoJHQb_i7bHEkPi1b1kEBD7T2yZLwAV=w1679-h944-no)

so I added a nice thick washer on the top that was the same OD as the mount to prevent digging and also got a stock ford bottom mount (which you have to clearance on the front end:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/zMp-kRUOlxGjeO8VyNBjFw3f0xeDS8IoBYNxyfqXUJXe6OW_1UCEwkeGwPoqxyOKpIWFtRBRuREcukCxV-Dn9UnzQQvnbR7ud-ys4kWYeOX71gxhvI9KXyjryFqI0YusUlkFjKSLtrlbk7WpPNBo5WbVz40ndGRZtn_wYcTO488WN3094mfr49E2p8LJgud-L_oXlq8aAVIryHNS3TiEJHXtFgJd75J8-rp3dWQ1xwuCsGyc6HJsCYf81tVp60cWHPLfKjWZw2-KgBUo28Rr1gX7Vf5T5p79kpJuAp-fxUPjH-DjteCZKD2PpQPAt-El0jPHnL7D5TTV8M87dynVQIp3klfbZmvMkxaVQZnFJycLDV_Y6kGAliLN5LnU2i4WO6speyvFaJ6QjfyRH9X642drpuGxg-m8XJ4a4Mq1_xJGlOfPKqP1KQAUpNlJXjZuhvJm5MMa8e5zbbEtXWFurhYkqeg2K9fXhiizGs65ve3H1D6PlDtXG1W84SG984QqiowspOtL2IrYhpZbKQDdc5GDFfn8JvQMpwe_HNleZaTyAnlWbRafaSTqz2L5PzavdjO2PsaITxOPHzoJdzpTb6_74rKt-TVPmWaly9VdDjeobDBiJoxZ=w1679-h944-no)

a full season of auto-cross later it's still going strong and wheel hop is much better:
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/MH_s1R23GTbcjI9uY6W1u8CcFnJbEDJdoZmN-72tbcwrv66EHwzXkUJNTwZ-kJEVqw3RR-gL4X4D3P_VxP4L5-FAUCunRgtpJ8sACnKwQDCGw6H5kAqmr_Lkhpi45qXhMJCEiI63luHqmykfeMv9n4jYO9uI_CBGzamHclM3UJIoU0bt7an9aWjTDADdK8bCegrWrsvIdohBH02HiYIhiDKfja7szGOJTtEKKYDtCT9F63fxHjavHD8KMf1u1E8wvrbsoXPB1D3v-NJJBIClO4VD3Nkdjn_CasV2orcymoHipM9M5X9hXWrmSJje0x_XTRQmAnURK9pTfK63GkOQv3-lUvdI3TJ4FETqVhpbKG_5ymh4Zo3wgR-cw1HveslB_gwHvnjNJHW_bH_x-WnCld3TpGAypQGxWnkb2w6bVZTYRlRIt0VRAxdBIu7WobRKWmuNKcXQZQxtz2S2w3OnyfFbJkl-H9h_cJSFMVkypp8--oHpvVMkb7Bne9UmgCRKKgzWqeZ6uQ0Ues9XLNOLFHs2pRQAC_WWxhvwR_jgkSaDRJs2LGvs1O23cbcaibdARSmFMlPJMZcfOpastYrQTanaqO1evOL5LvHJS84EWKs8Z0foEew2=w1679-h944-no)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 06, 2017, 01:31:20 PM
Eage8,

Thanks for the feedback.  I'm doubly happy to report we've already addressed both of the comments.  The side straps flare to be sure they're have full coverage up top and we're also including the OEM Ford rubber bits for the bottom side of the mount as well.   We're big believers in continuous improvement around here!   :cheers:

-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on March 07, 2017, 03:43:47 PM
iv'e been looking but can't find them,could someone please post a link ,im ready to start my 8.8 swap and I would like to have all my ducks in a row first
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 07, 2017, 03:45:55 PM
iv'e been looking but can't find them,could someone please post a link ,im ready to start my 8.8 swap and I would like to have all my ducks in a row first

Ronin is at www.roninspeedworks.com (http://www.roninspeedworks.com) (or .net, makes no difference)

The complete FC 8.8 is sold here:
http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=104 (http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=104)

Thanks for the interest!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on March 08, 2017, 11:36:20 AM
thanks , I've already got 8.8 kit ,I'm looking for rear frame bushings, I was looking stock rubber but it has been suggestion to use solid mounts, on another note has anyone had problems pushing in the stock bushing in the diff mount,mine seem to want to kinda fold over on each half.im using a 20 ton press trying to keep it strait as I can , any advise would appreciated :banghead:
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on March 08, 2017, 11:42:19 AM
thanks , I've already got 8.8 kit ,I'm looking for rear frame bushings, I was looking stock rubber but it has been suggestion to use solid mounts, on another note has anyone had problems pushing in the stock bushing in the diff mount,mine seem to want to kinda fold over on each half.im using a 20 ton press trying to keep it strait as I can , any advise would appreciated :banghead:

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 08, 2017, 11:43:45 AM
Solid mounts are not recommended.  They end up binding on the studs which can create stress issues if you don't ream them open.  If you ream them open then it's easy to end up sloppy.  My favorite bushings for this application are the Mazda Comp isolators available from Mazdatrix.  They're an OEM form factor with a much higher durometer rubber.

Do you have the install instructions?  All our install instructions live here if you need them http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=7 (http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=7)   I just triple checked but there is a picture of the worm gear clamp assist that's a big help in getting the bushings started on page 17.  You basically compress the two sides of the bushing together to get it started in the hole.  Once it's going, you pull the clamp off and finish the press.

-Joel (for RSW)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on March 08, 2017, 12:13:12 PM
Yeah. What he said. ^^^^^^^^^^

You'll like them much better and I had no wheel hop with them.

http://youtu.be/pv_2-36LNqI (http://youtu.be/pv_2-36LNqI)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on March 08, 2017, 01:26:39 PM
ii 'm looking for rear frame bushings not diff bushings
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 08, 2017, 01:39:53 PM
MMR used to be my go to on subframe bushings, but they seem to be out of business (or at least not selling to the public).  Solid is fine for the subframe and there are a quite a few options on Ebay for those.  The only one's we typically do not recommned are the Powered by Max bushings since they raise the subframe and it screws up the pinion geometry.  You can run them but you need a spacer to put the subframe back were we intended.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on March 08, 2017, 06:41:36 PM
ii 'm looking for rear frame bushings not diff bushings


You need to pay close attention to detail when mocking up and assembling this kit with solid subframe bushings.  Loosely put the diff in the car first, then mount the subframe in the car, and torque it to spec. Do not install a sub link. Then mock up the diff and tack weld the front mount into place. You'll likely need an adjustable sub link, as the OE unit may not land in the right place anymore. I did it this way to make sure the subframe was mounted perfectly square in the car. FWIW i run the not recommended fully solid mount setup. It does require diff mount reaming and some extra attention to detail during setup. I also had some custom tapered spacers made to set the pinion angle on the front mount and lock the front mount down solid.

There are delrin FC subframe bushings on EBay for $78 or so.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/182410925635 (https://www.ebay.com/itm/182410925635)

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: racer#93 on March 09, 2017, 07:16:00 PM
I found some rear subframe bushings at the dealer 125 ea >:(  I went and got solid on ebay. :)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 06, 2017, 01:26:50 AM
so ive read a lot of this thread and its been very helpful but unfortunately a lot of reference pictures are dead because of photobuket. im attempting the mockup tomorrow for the first time and a buddy is coming over to tack weld the mount in place. my main concern is pinon angle. is this something that i will know when its set right once i lift the subframe into place or are there measurements that i need to take in order to ensure its properly aligned? if measurements are involved, is there a procedure on how to do so? appreciate the help norotors family!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 06, 2017, 05:04:28 PM
Today i noticed the ford rubber mount for the bottom of the front mount was not included with my kit. Is there a part number for that? Or are the three rubber washers sent suppose to take its place?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 06, 2017, 11:45:18 PM
The 3 rubber washers will take its place.

Your Explorer rear has the large “cobra” flange that you’ll likely need to remove that to mock up everything. You’ll want an angle finder and set the pinion angle equal and opposite to your engine/trans angle. If the engine is pointing down 1.5 degrees, you want the pinion shaft on the diff pointing up 1.5 degrees.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 07, 2017, 12:13:25 AM
The 3 rubber washers will take its place.

Your Explorer rear has the large “cobra” flange that you’ll likely need to remove that to mock up everything. You’ll want an angle finder and set the pinion angle equal and opposite to your engine/trans angle. If the engine is pointing down 1.5 degrees, you want the pinion shaft on the diff pointing up 1.5 degrees.

Awesome...although thats terrible news for me since the drivetrain is out of the car. I guess this means completeing engine/trans assembly before the diff goes in. Was really hoping to make progress on the differential install while waiting on parts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 07, 2017, 06:27:58 PM
So i just want to clarify. Pinion angle is adjusted by adding removing washers correct? The weld in mounting point doesnt have any up/down adjustment so kind of where it lands, thats it? I just want to know if i could have everything welded and mounted in the car and just play around with pinion angle once the rest of the drive train is in. Also, i know in the instructions it says to grind weld in mount to achive fitment. Not sure how and if anything needs to be ground down in my case:
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g249/dominicansnoopss/Mobile%20Uploads/20171206_154148_zpsivuuim2p.jpg) (http://s58.photobucket.com/user/dominicansnoopss/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20171206_154148_zpsivuuim2p.jpg.html)
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g249/dominicansnoopss/Mobile%20Uploads/20171206_154246_zpsxqmmzbjp.jpg) (http://s58.photobucket.com/user/dominicansnoopss/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20171206_154246_zpsxqmmzbjp.jpg.html)
(http://i58.photobucket.com/albums/g249/dominicansnoopss/Mobile%20Uploads/20171206_154140_zpst0bnucqp.jpg) (http://s58.photobucket.com/user/dominicansnoopss/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20171206_154140_zpst0bnucqp.jpg.html)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 07, 2017, 07:52:23 PM
If you want to do it without the drivetrain in the car just tack weld it in place in case you are wrong.

What I would do is mock up the rear subframe in the car with the diff, not just weld it in off the car.

Put the rear diff mount on the diff.
Mount the diff from the rear mount posts on the car loosely.
Mount the subframe and sub link.
Then begin positioning the front diff mount, check pinion angle and tack front mount in place from there.
Remove subframe and weld front mount.

If you are not in a position to do all of that, I wouldn’t bother as you’ll likely need to do rework later.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 07, 2017, 08:02:06 PM
If you want to do it without the drivetrain in the car just tack weld it in place in case you are wrong.

What I would do is mock up the rear subframe in the car with the diff, not just weld it in off the car.

Put the rear diff mount on the diff.
Mount the diff from the rear mount posts on the car loosely.
Mount the subframe and sub link.
Then begin positioning the front diff mount, check pinion angle and tack front mount in place from there.
Remove subframe and weld front mount.

If you are not in a position to do all of that, I wouldn’t bother as you’ll likely need to do rework later.

Thats pretty much what i was planning on doing. The only thing is the "check pinion angle" part. Being that the drivetrain isnt in place im not sure what angle to look for giving the welder the go ahead to weld into place.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on December 07, 2017, 10:09:11 PM
Worst case scenario you can also adjust pinion angle using a sub-frame adjustable camber link or by adjusting the spacing of the front mount...  it's not ideal, but it'll do in a pinch.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 07, 2017, 10:32:15 PM
Worst case scenario you can also adjust pinion angle using a sub-frame adjustable camber link or by adjusting the spacing of the front mount...  it's not ideal, but it'll do in a pinch.


Correct. But if you run solid subframe bushings you’ll only be able to shim the subframe down, not use an adjustable sublink.

I used an aluminium bushing in place of the rubber washers to set the pinion angle, but I have solid bushings everywhere.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 07, 2017, 11:41:15 PM
Worst case scenario you can also adjust pinion angle using a sub-frame adjustable camber link or by adjusting the spacing of the front mount...  it's not ideal, but it'll do in a pinch.

I am running a adjustable camber line (subframe link). Im running OEM bushings on the subframe and mazda comp bushings on the differential. I apologize for my confusion but im missing what the "correct" way of setting the pinon angle is. Like i stated before, the weld in mount location doesnt seem to have any up/down adjustablitily since it has the "slot" where it slides into the subframe. Before actually putting it next to where its eventually going to be welded, i was under the impression there was multiple postions on how it could be welded. Im sorry if im not making any sense, i just rather gather information and do it right the first time.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 07, 2017, 11:58:40 PM
Maybe im wording it incorrectly, here was my game plan and let me know if im missing something:

1. Bolt differential in using rear two post mounts
2. Lift subframe, secure to chasis and attatch sub link (should i not be using a adjustable link?)
3. Using hardware attach weld in mount to front diff mount and mock up to subframe
4. Sand down area and tack weld front mount
5. Remove subframe and finish welding in front mount


I just want to make sure that where ever the mount "lands" will be the right location. I cant see how it will be wrong but im just getting confused with all the talk about measuring pinon angle prior to welding on the mount. My confusion comes in being that i dont see how it can be incorrectly pitched. Please help me clarify this and gain some confidence with this task.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 08, 2017, 12:01:48 AM
The front mount only goes on one way, but there is some variance in it. You are not going to be able to set your pinion angle until the engine is in the car. Like I said, I’d tack it into place at most if it were me, but if you want to go for it and finish weld it, have at it, you just have fewer options when you actually have to set the pinion angle if it needs adjustment.

Without the engine in, you don't know what your engine angle is going to be, and therefore what your pinion angle will need to be. This is pretty critical, because if it is too far off you can get vibration, driveline wear etc.

If you finish weld the front mount now, you'll still have some adjustment, but have fewer options to fix any issues.

Yes you can use an adjustable sublink, but I would set it to the stock length for mockup, again because you don't know what adjustments you are going to have to make down the line. Plus this will also affect the rear camber, and adjusting that later could cause other new problems as it twists the subframe.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 08, 2017, 12:16:16 AM
I appreciate your help and ill take your word for it and not finish the welds yet.

I guess i just dont see the variance but i guess when talking in degrees minimal changes can cause the pinion angle to change. Very unfortunate i can't make any progress and cross this off my lost while the drivetrain is out.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 08, 2017, 12:22:07 AM
Yes you can use an adjustable sublink, but I would set it to the stock length for mockup, again because you don't know what adjustments you are going to have to make down the line. Plus this will also affect the rear camber, and adjusting that later could cause other new problems as it twists the subframe.

The camberlink is currently set to the adjustment i was running last year to get the camber within spec. I guess i will set it to stock length, get the diff installed, set pinion angle and than when i get a alignment the sublink is going to throw off my pinion angle...lol i really need to get a grasp on this and try and figure out what im missing.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on December 08, 2017, 09:50:04 AM
That's why that's a terrible way to adjust camber :)  it does the same thing to the stock diff...

ronin links are great :)

http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=91 (http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=91)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 08, 2017, 10:57:15 AM
Yes you can use an adjustable sublink, but I would set it to the stock length for mockup, again because you don't know what adjustments you are going to have to make down the line. Plus this will also affect the rear camber, and adjusting that later could cause other new problems as it twists the subframe.

The camberlink is currently set to the adjustment i was running last year to get the camber within spec. I guess i will set it to stock length, get the diff installed, set pinion angle and than when i get a alignment the sublink is going to throw off my pinion angle...lol i really need to get a grasp on this and try and figure out what im missing.


Yea, do not go welding it in, you are going to screw yourself. Buy Ronin camber links and run the sublink close to or at the stock length.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on December 08, 2017, 11:44:20 AM
Yes you can use an adjustable sublink, but I would set it to the stock length for mockup, again because you don't know what adjustments you are going to have to make down the line. Plus this will also affect the rear camber, and adjusting that later could cause other new problems as it twists the subframe.

The camberlink is currently set to the adjustment i was running last year to get the camber within spec. I guess i will set it to stock length, get the diff installed, set pinion angle and than when i get a alignment the sublink is going to throw off my pinion angle...lol i really need to get a grasp on this and try and figure out what im missing.


Yea, do not go welding it in, you are going to screw yourself. Buy Ronin camber links and run the sublink close to or at the stock length.


^^^ What he said.

You definitely do not want to weld anything until you get your motor and trans in. Install everything and tighten down. Connect driveshaft and measure away.
Get your angles verified then tack it. (I actually used vise grips to hold things in place as I don't trust my welding) I then removed the subframe and had my buddy weld it up.
My car was smooth as silk.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 08, 2017, 08:24:27 PM
Guess i shouldve went with ronins setup before investing in PBM camber links and adjustable sub link. Time to rethink my setup. Appreicate all the help fellas!
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 09, 2017, 01:27:50 AM
PBM dogbones and an adjustable sublink are ok. You didn’t say that before. You are just not going to get much less adjustment out of the sublink after you add the Ronin front mount.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on December 09, 2017, 09:06:51 AM
PBM dogbones and an adjustable sublink are ok. You didn’t say that before. You are just not going to get much less adjustment out of the sublink after you add the Ronin front mount.

Before reading this i bit the bullet on the "stage 2" ronin camber links..i hope they are actually a different length then the PBM dogbones or else that was a complete waste of money. So from what im understanding now, set adjustable sublink to stock length. Leave the PBM dogbones installed. Set pinon angle and weld in. At that point i can use the sublink to adjust camber i just wont have as much adjustability as i did with stock diff?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on December 09, 2017, 11:25:33 AM
It depends on how low you have the car. Ronin makes one link that is shorter than the PBM links. There is also enough slop in the bolt holes to get a little fine camber adjustment. If you can get away without using the sublink at all and just getting the correct length camber links, That is what you want.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Tomo on February 05, 2018, 05:24:30 PM
I'm collecting up all the parts needed to do this swap, and I'm soon to buy the Ronin portions ( :wave: ).

Just a few questions. I've already got an Explorer diff and some explorer axles, with 626 Turbo axles on the way so I can try to sell all my T2 stuff together.

I just picked up the Timken wheel bearings and the seals people sourced out as working with the slightly different 626 parts. The Diff stub axle seals that are in the Ford FSB as being a potential problem. Seems no one makes them anymore? Which seems plenty weird. Couldn't find a source for those, anyone do the work to replace them? Can you do it without completely removing the internals?

The front pinion flange. The explorer one is not recommended because its so large as to need clearance with the subframe, is this correct? I saw links to the 'small' Mustang 8.8 flange. Did anyone take this job up themselves (apologies if so, the pictures are now all borked thanks to photobucket). If so I guess I'll source and hope the job isn't a major pain. I don't think there's anything else I can do there 'easily' while I've got the flange off. (Pinion seal for example).

I'm currently set to use solid mounts for the diff and subframe. I already have the MMR diff mounts (grabbed them right before he disappeared), and PBM Subframe. I know this isn't the most recommended path. But given they are parts I already have, I couldn't imagine parting with $$ to get the Mazda Comp bushings.

Question is, (Bowtie7..) what is the thickness of the extra spacer needed? I can probably get something hacked together that will work, I have the MMR front control arm UHWM bushings I *could* chop up. Just have no idea what I'm aiming for.

Uh...I think that's it for now? I'm sure this will all take longer than I'd *really* like. But I've started on this adventure.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on February 05, 2018, 09:15:33 PM
I'm collecting up all the parts needed to do this swap, and I'm soon to buy the Ronin portions ( :wave: ).

Just a few questions. I've already got an Explorer diff and some explorer axles, with 626 Turbo axles on the way so I can try to sell all my T2 stuff together.

I just picked up the Timken wheel bearings and the seals people sourced out as working with the slightly different 626 parts. The Diff stub axle seals that are in the Ford FSB as being a potential problem. Seems no one makes them anymore? Which seems plenty weird. Couldn't find a source for those, anyone do the work to replace them? Can you do it without completely removing the internals?

The front pinion flange. The explorer one is not recommended because its so large as to need clearance with the subframe, is this correct? I saw links to the 'small' Mustang 8.8 flange. Did anyone take this job up themselves (apologies if so, the pictures are now all borked thanks to photobucket). If so I guess I'll source and hope the job isn't a major pain. I don't think there's anything else I can do there 'easily' while I've got the flange off. (Pinion seal for example).

I'm currently set to use solid mounts for the diff and subframe. I already have the MMR diff mounts (grabbed them right before he disappeared), and PBM Subframe. I know this isn't the most recommended path. But given they are parts I already have, I couldn't imagine parting with $$ to get the Mazda Comp bushings.

Question is, (Bowtie7..) what is the thickness of the extra spacer needed? I can probably get something hacked together that will work, I have the MMR front control arm UHWM bushings I *could* chop up. Just have no idea what I'm aiming for.

Uh...I think that's it for now? I'm sure this will all take longer than I'd *really* like. But I've started on this adventure.

Here's a post from my Ronin swap. One difference is I used GKN outers (which are probably not available any longer)
Also, I had to shorten my driveshaft about an inch from what shows in the pictures. (was bottoming out on big bumps)

Hope this helps...

The Ronin 8.8 swap is in. Haven't had a chance to drive it yet. Too much salt on the roads and my engine is winterized. (I release all the valve spring tension in Winter because I'm running solid lifters and the car doesn't get started for a few months)
My carrier is from a 2005 Ford Explorer. I ordered the Ford Racing Track Lok LSD. Ford Racing 3.73 Hobb grind gears. All bearings and seals have been replaced. A local speedshop Kilpatrick Engine & Transmission rebuilt the diff for me. They also welded the cradle mount. Axle inners were from the Explorer, shafts are Ronin and outers are GKN.
I went with the 1310 flange and a one piece slip yoke on the driveshaft.
A local company with 3 locations in Wisconsin and Illinois, Machine Service, built my driveshaft for me.

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7278.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7278)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7276.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7276)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7275.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7275)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7274.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7274)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7271.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7271)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7268.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7268)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7269.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7269)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7218.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7218)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7277.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7277)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7279.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7279)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7280.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7280)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7281.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7281)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7282.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7282)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7283.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7283)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7284.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7284)

(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7285.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7285)

Dat asss!!  :D
(https://www.norotors.com/gallery/albums/Ronin_8_8_Swap/Dir_1/medium_7286.jpg) (https://www.norotors.com/index.php?action=gallery;sa=view;id=7286) 


Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Tomo on February 06, 2018, 11:17:05 AM
Pictures certainly are worth 1000 words. Looks great.

That is a very clean looking differential even if it is painted.

Looks like you conducted a very clean swap. You had your diff rebuild guys put the Mustang 8.8 small flange on the front end while they were refreshing all the seals and bearings?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: bikedad on February 06, 2018, 11:43:34 AM
Pictures certainly are worth 1000 words. Looks great.

That is a very clean looking differential even if it is painted.

Looks like you conducted a very clean swap. You had your diff rebuild guys put the Mustang 8.8 small flange on the front end while they were refreshing all the seals and bearings?

Yes. I believe it's part of setting the preload on the pinion. I just used the Carrier from the Explorer and had all Ford Racing LSD, Ring and Pinion and Rebuild kit put in.

You can go with the larger flange but you will have to modify your subframe. When you purchase the Ronin 8.8 kit they will give you a link to a PDF for instructions plus ideas for your install. In the PDF they cover the 1350 Flange subframe modification very well.
My car was 400 RWHP and the smaller flange was fine. Most of my action was track day events at Road America and a couple outings at Great Lakes Dragway.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: eage8 on February 06, 2018, 11:52:30 AM
There is a bunch of good info in the ronin instructions:

http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=7 (http://www.roninspeedworks.net/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=7)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DrKarrot on February 06, 2018, 02:48:00 PM
So I picked up a used sub-frame and 8.8 and have been driving it for a couple of weeks. Finally got it out on the interstate and I've got a pretty nasty vibe around 2100 or more RPMS in 6th on my T56 (no speedo...). Its there in any other gear and gets worse with speed, so I checked my driveline angles and they're seemingly pretty screwy. Looking at about +4 degrees nose up at the pinion, and -2 at the slip yoke, relative to the driveshaft. I was able to get the pinion down to about +2 by pulling the washer between the diff and the front mount, and cranking the diff mounts into the body as much as possible, but now the pinion flange on the driveshaft is hitting the subframe, so I am pretty much back where I started.

Are these angles "close enough" and my vibe just due to a relatively skinny, heavy steel shaft/bad balance? I am using a different slip yoke than the shaft was originally balanced with. Or should I go through the trouble of trying to reverse the pinion-up yoke-down angles?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Tomo on February 06, 2018, 04:11:14 PM
It sounds like bad  DS Flange angles to me.

Likely the problem picking up a used kit, unless they had the same front mounts, or everything positioned quite the same way you do, the way it was all welded together is going to be suited for a different driveline angle.

Sounds like its largely to your benefit that you can get the angles to be matching by removing the rubber washers and cranking down on the front mount, but it does sound like clearance to your subframe is the cost. As i see it, you've got 2 options. Grind at the subframe until it clears, or use inserts above the subframe mounts to shim it down. 

The second may not work still given the front mount situation, but it could mean that you can put a rubber washer back in there. you'd keep the same angle but lift the nose off the sub frame.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: DrKarrot on February 07, 2018, 09:29:58 AM
Thanks so much for the advice! Spacing the subframe down seems like the easiest longer term solution if I want to avoid re-welding the mount, it wouldn't need much spacing to add some nose-down at the pinion.

Last night I flipped the crown washers and cranked the diff up so that it is firmly against the body, and kept the front mount washer. I've got maybe 1/8th of a inch of clearance to the subframe, but its still a degree or two nose up, and I couldn't get any contact even with a couple hard launches and immediate release of power. The serious vibrations seem to have gone away, but I also changed out the u-joints, all of which felt fine, but one had some "burnt" grease inside of it.

I have to drop the subframe to weld up the beginning of some fatigue cracking on the front mount and the passenger side diff arm, I might chop off the front mount and reweld it more appropriately to my car then if I'm feeling up to it.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Drsnoopy on March 04, 2018, 05:30:18 PM
so today i got around to mocking everything up and despite a ton of reading and looking at pictures it didnt work out as planned. so heres how it went: currently have mazda comp differntial bushings and derlin subframe bushing. i mounted the differntial by the two posts. i then lifted the subframe into place (with the hubs/control arms still attachted). i tightened down the subframe. i now positioned the weld on mount and slid the bolt through. i tightened down on the bolt, when i did this it brought the nose of the pinion down to meet the subframe. when it did this it put the weld on mount on a angle away from the subframe making it misaligned. what am i getting wrong? i was under the impression i was going to have to point the pinion upwards to meet with the subframe. as it sits now it seems the differential sits higher than the subframe. im stumped right now and help is appreciated!

the below pictures show the weld on mount aligned with the subframe and the bolt passing through. as you can see the differential is not leaning against the 3 rubber washers and is infact higher than the mount.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on March 08, 2018, 03:55:31 PM
Hey Dr. Snoopy,

Not sure how long ago you ordered this but we've gone away from the rubber washers and now use the factory Ford isolator.   Since that isolator often doesn't come with your donor diff they're included in all kits sold.  It's Ford XW4Z-4B424-BA if you want to track one down.  (We're not very efficient as a middle man so you probably don't want to order from us).    I think we responded to an email inquiry from you as well, but since it might help other folks I'll add that info here.

=============

Focus on the pinion angle and let the mounts float a bit more if needed.  You might try it with the front mount bolted only finger tight.  Part of the reason we prefer compliant bushings is so they can take up a few degrees of misalignment if needed.  It's also acceptable to shim down the rear mounts or shim up the nose further if you find that helps.

If you have non-stock pieces in your subframe mounting vertical link or bushings that's often suspect as well.  For instance, PBM subframe bushing are thin and raise the subframe.  That's no good with our geometry.

So long as the trans output and pinion axis are nearly parallel (equal and opposite angles), that's what matters.

============

Hope that helps!
-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: FC355 on April 15, 2018, 04:47:15 PM
Hey guys, I’m test fitting the 8.8 in my FC right now and have a few questions, sounds like I’m about where Drsnoopy left off.  Sorry for the length but want to make sure I get the big picture here.  Appreciate if you all can check me, thanks!
 Components:
I’ve got mazda comps on the diff and level zero delrins on the subframe, stock sublink, small pinion flange.  All other rear suspension parts are off right now, but they include spherical bearing, Ronin camber links, new poly bushings. 

Background: 
I’m hoping to do get this kit done first, which would currently go to the 200-4R automatic transmission right now, which is going to a small block chevy.  Then drive it to my mentor’s place to swap the engine to a small block we built, then worry about getting the T56 in there, followed by getting a new driveshaft, resetting the pinion angle, and getting someone to weld it.  It sounds like it is feasible to get it driving without doing the welding first?  Or is it a lot safer to install the T56 before driving the car to swap the engine?

Driveshaft question/suspension:
My current DS is way too short, so do I need to put the rest of the suspension components (camber link, toe control hub, axles, etc.) back on to put the car on the ground to measure for a driveshaft?  Or while the car is on 4 jackstands, just measure the diff to the output shaft?  I was thinking buy the driveshaft after I figure the pinion angle and put everything back on.

 Fitment:
1-   Differential.  So here I’m just using washers to find the right pinion angle to pair with the output shaft of the transmission?  In my pics I snugged it down as a starting point, I'm assuming this is problem #1.
 
2-   Subframe. 
-I snugged it down as well and in the current state, it hits the front mount isolator and will not rise high enough to line up with the stock sublink. 
-The small pinion flange fits however (If I were to clearance the isolator however, the flange would hit the subframe). 
-The front support hole is not lining up with the subframe hole.  I assume I need to get the rest figured out first, then this should fit better anyway/require a little trimming maybe?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on July 03, 2018, 10:24:22 AM
Anyone have issues with the outer CV's slinging grease badly?  I ordered a replacement boot and clamp kit from Ronin, but I'm worried that the mild pitting/corrosion on the outer CV will not let them seal properly.  The inside of my wheels and my hubs were absolutely caked in grease after the last race.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on July 04, 2018, 01:44:31 PM
Yea, I had that problem. I think it was from brake heat.

I vented the small side with a small piece of WD40 red straw. I used some black RTV to fill the gaps. I cleaned and re strapped the large side of the outer. It has been good ever since.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Supe on July 04, 2018, 10:52:30 PM
Yea, I had that problem. I think it was from brake heat.

I vented the small side with a small piece of WD40 red straw. I used some black RTV to fill the gaps. I cleaned and re strapped the large side of the outer. It has been good ever since.

I had a huge rear brake bias issue, so that may be the case.  Will try the RTV first and vent the small end if need be, thanks.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: onefastrx7turbo on November 10, 2018, 10:57:33 PM
Just a sanity check. I did my driveshaft measurements and here is what I came up with:

From the transmission face to the 8.8 differential flange, I got 38 1/2 inches with the shaft sticking out 5/8s inch. Does this sound right?
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: Orracle on February 01, 2019, 09:13:58 AM
What's everyone doing to source T2 stub shafts? I'm having a pretty hard time locating a set.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: FC355 on February 02, 2019, 09:33:05 AM
Some would pop up on eBay from time to time and I also went on to one of those sites that you put in what part you're looking for and junkyards around the country can email you. Worked surprisingly well to get both the diff and the shafts.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fattony on April 08, 2019, 07:57:24 AM
Hey Joel,

Im having this exact issue. I ordered the kit maybe a year ago or longer. What bushings do you recommend with your kit?

Thanks,

Hey Dr. Snoopy,

Not sure how long ago you ordered this but we've gone away from the rubber washers and now use the factory Ford isolator.   Since that isolator often doesn't come with your donor diff they're included in all kits sold.  It's Ford XW4Z-4B424-BA if you want to track one down.  (We're not very efficient as a middle man so you probably don't want to order from us).    I think we responded to an email inquiry from you as well, but since it might help other folks I'll add that info here.

=============

Focus on the pinion angle and let the mounts float a bit more if needed.  You might try it with the front mount bolted only finger tight.  Part of the reason we prefer compliant bushings is so they can take up a few degrees of misalignment if needed.  It's also acceptable to shim down the rear mounts or shim up the nose further if you find that helps.

If you have non-stock pieces in your subframe mounting vertical link or bushings that's often suspect as well.  For instance, PBM subframe bushing are thin and raise the subframe.  That's no good with our geometry.

So long as the trans output and pinion axis are nearly parallel (equal and opposite angles), that's what matters.

============

Hope that helps!
-Joel
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fattony on April 08, 2019, 08:41:44 AM
I cut the sub frame for 1350 and to have clearance but when I started to mock everything up the diff rest about 1 mm from the sub frame. I'm running mmr bushings.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: frijolee on April 08, 2019, 06:15:29 PM
@fattony  You're probably going to have to ream the MMR bushings to get the pinion angle right (and the nose of the diff to rise).  We've been running into enough folks with challenges on solid bushings fighting the vertical chassis pins that I'm planning to only recommend rubber bushings on the FC kit going forward.

A pinion yoke is another way to gain clearance.

Regards,
Joel (for RSW)
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 08, 2019, 06:18:17 PM
I cut the sub frame for 1350 and to have clearance but when I started to mock everything up the diff rest about 1 mm from the sub frame. I'm running mmr bushings.


What is your pinion angle there? You may need to raise it anyway to get the proper pinion angle. I also had to ream my MMR diff bushings a bit to get enough movement to set the pinion angle properly. I also have a solid aluminium spacer under my front diff mount to solidly set the pinion angle.

Joel treed me.

Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: fattony on April 13, 2019, 12:40:32 PM
Im out of town all this week but how should I ream out the MMR bushing? Im more or less asking what you used dremel or file and any advice.
Title: Re: FC Explorer 8.8 Diff Kit
Post by: largeorangefont on April 14, 2019, 11:07:47 AM
Drill them out a bit. A dremel or die grinder will work. Just take your time and do a little at a time until you get to the pinion angle where you need it.